article:We feel worthless, because we actually are worth less.

Discussion in 'Suicidal Thoughts and Feelings' started by GabrielConroy, Dec 7, 2009.

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  1. GabrielConroy

    GabrielConroy Well-Known Member

    funny and applicable article i came across on cracked(trig warning here):

    We feel worthless, because we actually are worth less.

    There's one advantage to having mostly online friends, and it's one that nobody ever talks about:

    They demand less from you.

    Sure, you emotionally support them, comfort them after a breakup, maybe even talk them out of a suicide. But knowing someone in meatspace adds a whole, long list of annoying demands. Wasting your whole afternoon helping them fix their computer. Going to funerals with them. Toting them around in your car every day after theirs gets repossessed by the bank. Having them show up unannounced when you were just settling in to watch the Dirty Jobs marathon on the Discovery channel, then mentioning how hungry they are until you finally give them half your sandwich.

    You have so much more control in Instant Messenger, or on a forum, or in World of Warcraft.

    The problem is you are hard-wired by evolution to need to do things for people. Everybody for the last five thousand years seemed to realize this and then we suddenly forgot it in the last few decades. We get suicidal teens and scramble to teach them self-esteem. Well, unfortunately, self-esteem and the ability to like yourself only come after you've done something that makes you likable. You can't bullshit yourself. If I think Todd over here is worthless for sitting in his room all day, drinking Pabst and playing video games one-handed because he's masturbating with the other one, what will I think of myself if I do the same thing?

    You want to break out of that black tar pit of self-hatred? Brush the black hair out of your eyes, step away from the computer and buy a nice gift for someone you loathe. Send a card to your worst enemy. Make dinner for your mom and dad. Or just do something simple, with an tangible result. Go clean the leaves out of the gutter. Grow a damn plant.

    It ain't rocket science; you are a social animal and thus you are born with little happiness hormones that are released into your bloodstream when you see a physical benefit to your actions. Think about all those teenagers in their dark rooms, glued to their PC's, turning every life problem into ridiculous melodrama. Why do they make those cuts on their arms? It's because making the pain-and subsequent healing-tangible releases endorphins they don't get otherwise. It's pain, but at least it's real.

    That form of stress relief via mild discomfort used to be part of our daily lives, via our routine of hunting gazelles and gathering berries and climbing rocks and fighting bears. No more. This is why office jobs make so many of us miserable; we don't get any physical, tangible result from our work. But do construction out in the hot sun for two months, and for the rest of your life you can drive past a certain house and say, "Holy shit, I built that." Maybe that's why mass shootings are more common in offices than construction sites.

    It's the kind of physical, dirt-under-your-nails satisfaction that you can only get by turning off the computer, going outdoors and re-connecting with the real world. That feeling, that "I built that" or "I grew that" or "I fed that guy" or "I made these pants" feeling, can't be matched by anything the internet has to offer.

    Except, you know, this website.
  2. pit

    pit Well-Known Member

    I hear you, but I do get immense satisfaction from a good wank.

  3. TWF

    TWF Well-Known Member

    I already have most of that and I still feel worthless because most of the things you mentioned and most of the things I do don't mean that much to me. Its hard to explain, its like I've lost the will to live, the desire... I am worth something but everything is worth nothing to me because at the end of the day I am still me and I hate me and who I've become.

    Props for the post though, should help some people.
  4. Prinnctopher's Belt

    Prinnctopher's Belt Antiquities Friend SF Supporter

    No person is worthless. But everyone certainly is pointless.

    The truth of the matter is no matter what good you do for others, and for what duration and with what frequency, if you have inner demons that have not been conquered or removed, your ass is a dead duck. The author of that article can take it how he wants to take it. :throw:
  5. GabrielConroy

    GabrielConroy Well-Known Member

    I doubt he graces this site
  6. Tobes

    Tobes Well-Known Member

    If that were true, we'd all be unemployed and living on the computer. That may be the case for some people, but that would be those who had given up on trying to conquer their demons and do some good in the world. Everyone has demons, and they shouldn't have to hinder us from our day to day activities. Unfortunately they can and sometimes do, but it doesn't make our lives pointless.
  7. Mortal Moon

    Mortal Moon Well-Known Member

    This is great advice for people who want to accomplish things and participate in the real world. I used to be like that. Nowadays I'm too overwhelmed by the real world to be able to take part in it. The world outside my room is stressful, dangerous, unkind, unforgiving, unpredictable. It would crush me in a second. I prefer my bubble. :hiding:
  8. revoltra

    revoltra Well-Known Member

    A get that the article may be true for some people, but it's only directed at one type of group with depression. And there are so many different forms. I dont spend all day on a computer, and i do have a bit of the "real world" but i still have ad depression, ed, anxiety and really self destructive. Just like TWF said. You can have all those stuff but still have nothing. When you loose the desire to live all those stuff from the real world just doesn't mean anything to you anymore.
  9. molotov

    molotov Well-Known Member

    ah, i'm sorry, i never realized i was so unhappy because i'm a self-centered drama queen with an internet addiction and no social skills. thanks cracked!
  10. fromthatshow

    fromthatshow Staff Alumni SF Supporter

    :laugh: I like how in the same context of doing something for someone you don't like he put "Make dinner for your mom and dad" :)

    ODIECOM Well-Known Member

    i think we are the only ones in control of our happiness.
    yes, teen suicide is more than it used to be years ago. they are faced with more peer pressure than ever. todays society bases feelings for another on how they look, what kind of money they make, what they have and will i look good with that person. it is a self centered world today.
    that and the fact that, the age of imagination is LONG GONE. thats why there are so many reality shows on tv. its a socitey where we cant deal with our own crap so we eagerly await the evenings episode of someone elses bullshit.

    self worth comes from with in, its how we see ourselves. if we cant keep up with the jones's we must be less than they are. ppl will look down on us.

    its a world of trying to be something we arnt. if we cant be like someone else, we sink into our dark little hole believeing we are far less than the other.

    everyone has worth. many times we simply dont see it, because we are to busy trying to be some one we are not.
    we are not happy with our self.
    the act of cutting ... now possibly a fad with teens, was to take your mind off the trauma of the past or the present. i know several cutters.

    it applys pain to another part of their body and much like drugs or booze, it is a temp. fix to what really is. the true cutters take it very seriously.

    if you start your day negative, its gunna end negative. i used to be one of the biggest negative ppl. its how we think about our issues, friends or the ppl around us.
    i dont beleive i waste my time helping some one. i may never get anything back from them, but thats not the point of helping some one else
    to gain self esteem by doing something that gets recognised is only a temp. moment. the self esteem comes from with in. thats why so many ppl beleive if they have to impress in order to get recognition.

    the biggest battle we fight is with in ourself. we succumb to the peer pressure as teens. we allow others thoughts of us to control WHO WE ARE and HOW WE ACT.

    in todays world there is no ... be yourself. its a world of looking good, being impressive. being able to out shine, the other person.
    no one gives a damn anymore about what is inside the person. on the same token, we fail to see whats inside of us, because we are so busy keeping up with someone else, or busy being depressed because WE believe some one else is better than us.

    i used to be all of that. i believed you had to have signifiagance in order to be noticed. thats true as things go these days. but the real truth is, you just need to be yourself.
    thats why so many teens find ways to express themselves much differant from others.
    its a world of having to fit in.
    i have come to the time where i dont care what ppl think about me. i dont care if i dont have what they have. i know what i have, i know what my capabilites are. if ppl dont like it ... tuff shit.

    we control our happiness. if we fail to do so, then yes ... that post is most defenitly true.
    for me however ... i see it as negative to the way i think now, compaired to the way i used to think.

    ty for the post
  12. Aniki

    Aniki New Member

    I thought most people were deeper than that, doing good for self gratification is shallow imo.
    I don't care much if I like myself, what's important to me is being able to accept myself for who I am, trying to be mother Teresa wont make me a better person imo unless that's really who I am. Whats important imo is knowing WHO you are and for some people this is nearly impossible because of many layers of psychological trauma or issues. You can identify the problem or symptoms but not the source, the way this author describe things is extremely oversimplification of any case. Simple addiction can easily be overcome with a support network or enough determination, anyone can do it. When you don't remember why you are the way you are or cant point out why you are feeling something you should not be feeling that's when you have a problem. Computers is probably not the cause for most, isolation is an escape and the lifestyle is just a side effect.

    This is just stupid imo, whoever thinks making a dinner for ones parents is an achievement probably just suffers from extreme laziness, buying a gift for someone you loathe should just make you feel stupid not good.

    I were once in a workshop that educated streetchildren, with them I built a stool out of bamboo. When done I didn't really care for the stool I made, it wasn't special in any way to me. The time I spent there amongst these kids holds some value but manual labour really didn't bring anything to the table for me except releasing how boring it is.

    I think odiecom said some good things instead in the previous post. People really have to change their mentality and stop caring so much about what people think of them while still trying to fit in, hard part is finding the right people and work can also be an issue. I think that first one have to realise the worth of other peoples opinion and after doing so can dress however makes things easier while knowing this will change how other perceive an individual the individual must remember it's fake and and just a tool, not something to feel good about. For me it felt like everything was a farce, at work I only did or said what needed to be done without ever meaning it while always despising the people around me and this is imo a really bad thing since it obviously leads to a darker thoughts and mood. I think that if you don't really believe what the people around you believe and live after you will see the true intent of what they do and say and it might be hard to not despise them for it.
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 8, 2009
  13. johnnysays

    johnnysays Well-Known Member

    I kind of agree with this. A lot of people won't agree and will present valid arguments, but I think this makes more sense than over medicating our society. The key is to encourage youth (cost effectively) to acquire hobbies that yield real, tangible results. I don't mean just hitting the books, I mean pushing them to pursue their interests in ways that will directly help the world. And to help them develop those hobbies into real life skills that're marketable. It won't work for everyone, but it will for some.

    I really do feel people fall through the cracks in society. They miss the bus. They get stuck and lost in byways and offroads. They're at a point in life where getting going again is hard. Too often we turn to medicating them as an answer. I think it would be interesting to instead focus on field work that builds on their own talents and interests. That can help them rebuild their self-confidence and to give them the tools they need to re-enter the workforce in a meaningful way (i don't mean just finding a job at a gas station or just getting by on unemployment checks). This kind of thing is common for youth, but not so much for older people who're even harder to change. They come with a long history of memories, many of them bad. Lots of them feel they have no hope. Some of them end up in prison. Only then do they actually get attention and some needed help. Funny. Can they be reprogrammed?

    Maybe medicating them is less costly than fully restoring them, but it's not nearly as empowering or inspiring. There're so so many people just like this. Overly medicated, just barely getting by, and mostly hating themselves the entire way. (Think about the bitterness and shame they live with daily. Think about how this cloud of misery is to be shared with everyone around them.) They're no longer young, so who's going to help them? They're expected to do it all by themselves. This isn't realistically going to happen. What's instead going to happen is they're going to continue bleeding our country dry of money so that they can get their medication/ssi/food stamps/etc. The rest will end up on the streets. The worst will end up in prison or in an asylum. And we have to pay for it. How? We won't even be able to pay for medicare pretty soon. Obesity and over medicating people both young and old is going to make health care costs so high it'll cripple our nation. People should be in the prime of their life in middle age, not boxed up in their apartment doped up on anti-psychotics surviving on what little the government can afford. It's disgusting because these people are old before their time.

    I know the war in iraq and afghanistan have their reasons. We can't just leave those countries. It's a mess. But all of this money we spend battling foreign enemies could have been spent in getting more youth through college, on programs to get people off the streets and back into the market, and so on. We're going to end up spending trillions of dollars to afford these wars. It better be worth it.

    And sending all those jobs overseas because we're too lazy/dishonest to enforce standards on trading/outsourcing, well we'll get what we deserve. It's no wonder companies go overseas (and we import so much): to evade regulations and get cheap labor. Our own regulations and workers rights/compensation mean nothing if a company can skirt them and just go elsewhere. In my own view, we shouldn't be doing business with countries that work people 365 days a year, some of htem doing 14 hour days or more, and in ugly conditions without the rights that we enjoy in the US. I think our country doesn't really believe in its own set of regulations/laws/etc, otherwise this issue would have been settled a long time ago. It's not about opening up opportunities, it's about being true to yourself and emphasizing our rights and virtues over profit. If we're going to respect women and children and workers and give them clean air and clean water and so forth, we should expect the same of countries we do business with. Period. Profit and all the other BS can go to hell.
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 9, 2009
  14. Reki

    Reki Well-Known Member

    I think just about everyone understands that the Internet doesn't harbor any actual progress. They know if they want to actually make something of their lives, or at least change them, they have to take initiative physically and go out and do things, make friends, learn to be more interesting etc etc. Most boring people don't even realize they're boring until somebody bluntly points it out. I think everyone knows what they have to do to change, it's just that change can be a scary thing to attempt, especially when all you're used to is failure.
  15. Prinnctopher's Belt

    Prinnctopher's Belt Antiquities Friend SF Supporter

    The author of this article assumes that doing all of those things will make everyone feel better about their lives and everything will be honky-dorey. Like another poster can do all that shit and still be unhappy with your life, despite helping others. Hell, half the people on the forum are fucked up and hate their own lives, but try to give good advice to others. I help out in my community in many ways most suicidal others don't, and I'm still not happy with my life. So fuck this article. :throw:

    Like I said, if you have NOT conquered the demons you have, even doing this shit, your ass is still a dead duck. Studies show most people who attempt suicide in their past, do it again and succeed after a bowl of shit hits a fan somewhere down the line. This article hasn't convinced me of shit, except how ignorant, arrogant and passive the author is, and clearly doesn't know shit about fucked up people.
  16. GabrielConroy

    GabrielConroy Well-Known Member

    Honestly this self righteous attitude about having problems is one of the biggest barriers towards some peoples recovery
  17. molotov

    molotov Well-Known Member

    "Get over yourself" may be good advice for some people but I dislike the implication that it's a catch-all solution. A lot of people here are trying like mad to crawl out of some very deep holes. The "turn off the Joy Division and go plant some trees" attitude in the Cracked article for them is the opposite of helpful. But then, it's Cracked, I guess they meant it all in good fun..

    I just read 10 to 15 percent of people who attempt once eventually kill themselves. 1 percent in the same year, 3 percent within 5 years. I'd link the source but it's kind of sort of a methods website. But, hell, at least you know they're not biased towards over-optimistic reporting..
  18. spyke

    spyke Well-Known Member

    wow.... just wow

    <Mod Edit, WildCherry: Insulting>
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 9, 2009
  19. Godsdrummer

    Godsdrummer Guest

    Got that right!
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