Death?
- Thread starter Wildboy1
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Ive experienced two NDE's (Near Death Experiences) in my life, and susbsequently made a study of others experiences for several years.
So, from my own experience I know that the death of our physical body is just that - merely a physical death. But Ive never tried to 'convince' anyone else of that. Better to try and convince them of the preciousness and worth of their present life rather than the possibility of a future one perhaps.
So, from my own experience I know that the death of our physical body is just that - merely a physical death. But Ive never tried to 'convince' anyone else of that. Better to try and convince them of the preciousness and worth of their present life rather than the possibility of a future one perhaps.
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At the end of the day, no one knows. We can all guess and say we believe etc but there's no proof that can confirm what happens after death.
I was watching a TV drama the other night, one of the patients in the hospital had a very short time to live and she asked the doctor his thoughts on death. He said, he used to believe that when you die, you are trapped inside this black space and you can see, but you can't move but now he believes you simply sleep.
I believe you sleep, too... but then another part of me thinks sometimes you come back as a ghostly form... I really don't know.
I was watching a TV drama the other night, one of the patients in the hospital had a very short time to live and she asked the doctor his thoughts on death. He said, he used to believe that when you die, you are trapped inside this black space and you can see, but you can't move but now he believes you simply sleep.
I believe you sleep, too... but then another part of me thinks sometimes you come back as a ghostly form... I really don't know.
I don't know if you read my last post concerning this, but if you haven't please do in this thread...I thought maybe I got through, guess not. > http://suicideforum.com/showthread.php?t=16767&page=2
There isn't enough evidence to CONCLUDE anything regarding reincarnation. I have no problem with you believing in it, or even trying to convince other people of your beliefs. You have every right to do so. The problem that I do have is you insist it is a fact when it is clearly not. At least you changed the word "proof" to the word "conclude" but they are basically synonyms. To conclude something means to bring it to a final settlement. There is no final settlement to reincarnation being a fact. I'm sorry to bitch about it so much, I just hate when people try to convince people by presenting something as a fact when it is clearly not. If you want to convince people reincarnation is true, by all means present them with the evidence you have, suggest all the books and articles you want and let them make their OWN decision but by no means should you say that reincarnation has been "proven" or "concluded" in any way. Both those words suggest fact. Reincarnation is not yet known to be a fact and shouldn't be presented as so. I don't even have a problem with you saying that it is your own PERSONAL conclusion based on personal experience and other evidence; just don't present it as a scientific conclusion or fact as you are implying.
I like to share my opinion on my beliefs, but I in no way present them as being factual. They are my own opinions and theories based on my own experience and my own lame ass attempt at philosophical thinking.
Wildboy1, if you are interested in reading my opinions about death to help you form your own you can find some of my main points at these links, just look for my posts in these threads.
http://suicideforum.com/showthread.php?t=17958
http://suicideforum.com/showthread.php?t=18016
I'm sure you'll find them boring and nutty, but I hope they are of some help or at least entertaining in there absurdness.
There isn't enough evidence to CONCLUDE anything regarding reincarnation. I have no problem with you believing in it, or even trying to convince other people of your beliefs. You have every right to do so. The problem that I do have is you insist it is a fact when it is clearly not. At least you changed the word "proof" to the word "conclude" but they are basically synonyms. To conclude something means to bring it to a final settlement. There is no final settlement to reincarnation being a fact. I'm sorry to bitch about it so much, I just hate when people try to convince people by presenting something as a fact when it is clearly not. If you want to convince people reincarnation is true, by all means present them with the evidence you have, suggest all the books and articles you want and let them make their OWN decision but by no means should you say that reincarnation has been "proven" or "concluded" in any way. Both those words suggest fact. Reincarnation is not yet known to be a fact and shouldn't be presented as so. I don't even have a problem with you saying that it is your own PERSONAL conclusion based on personal experience and other evidence; just don't present it as a scientific conclusion or fact as you are implying.
I like to share my opinion on my beliefs, but I in no way present them as being factual. They are my own opinions and theories based on my own experience and my own lame ass attempt at philosophical thinking.
Wildboy1, if you are interested in reading my opinions about death to help you form your own you can find some of my main points at these links, just look for my posts in these threads.
http://suicideforum.com/showthread.php?t=17958
http://suicideforum.com/showthread.php?t=18016
I'm sure you'll find them boring and nutty, but I hope they are of some help or at least entertaining in there absurdness.
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First of all, as I stated in my previous post, at least one doctor has done an extensive and intensive study on reincarnation, giving quite a bit of evidence to it's existance. Secondly, many of the great philosophers believed in reincarnation. It's by no means fact, but it isn't exactly a new field of research either.
Even if there is an afterlife or reincarnation, not that I believe it, but for sake of argument lets say it's real. All of our memories are encapsulated in living brain cells which die when we die. So even if we have some sort of soul or supernatural ora that leaves our bodies it wouldn't remember anything about us. So if one kills themselves and ends up in hell or reborn into a worse existence or whatever our soul becomes after our bodies die, it would have no recollection of why the new being was suffering. So even if we have a soul that leaves us when we die; our own existence would be gone and a new existence would be created...and who cares if that new existence suffers, not our problem anymore cause our existence has ceased. Of course maybe all the billions of brain cells we have each have their own little soul that leaves with our body’s soul. Perhaps the brain cells do each have a soul and each little brain cell soul becomes part of one living thing that is born at the exact moment we die. So all of our memories are dispersed throughout the earth – or even the entire universe to billions of other living things. So all of us are not of one existence, but made up of billions of different existences from all around the universe – billions of brain cell souls from billions of different brains combined into one brain – our own. So we are all part of one another is a sense. Not that I believe any of this, and I am being a sarcastic ass for those of you who can’t tell. I suppose it is fun to think about though, and I don’t totally deny the impossibility of anything. Ahh, the things I think to occupy my boredom and loneliness:sad:
For those that believe in a soul and that all living things have souls, I suppose it isn't an absurd idea that even brain cells have souls or for that matter sperm cells. Now every time I masturbate I am going to imagine all the millions of little sperm cell souls being dispersed into other living creatures that are born as my sperm dies. In that case, I am everywhere. I am part of literally trillions of other living things. I am invincible, muhahahaha:laugh:
man i'm screwed up:ohmy:
For those that believe in a soul and that all living things have souls, I suppose it isn't an absurd idea that even brain cells have souls or for that matter sperm cells. Now every time I masturbate I am going to imagine all the millions of little sperm cell souls being dispersed into other living creatures that are born as my sperm dies. In that case, I am everywhere. I am part of literally trillions of other living things. I am invincible, muhahahaha:laugh:
man i'm screwed up:ohmy:
InnerStrength, are you the same person as non_existance? or am I just totally confused:huh:
Anyway. I said it before and I'll say it again. EVIDENCE does not equal PROOF. They are two entirely separate things. I don't doubt you can provide me with enough evidence of reincarnation to keep me occupied for 10 lifetimes (pun intended:laugh: ) but evidence doesn't provide concrete proof and reincarnation shouldn't be presented as scientific fact because it isn't. I'm not saying it isn't even real. I have know idea, it very well could be. I'm just saying there is no proof it is. Just because one doctor studies it (or a million doctors for that matter), and provides a lot of good evidence that it could be true, and you and I'm sure millions of other people think it is true, doesn't mean it is true. Secondly, philosophy don't amount to shit in this world. I like philosophy, I suppose I'm a philosopher myself, but what any philosopher says doesn't mean shit. In fact, I'll give you some synonyms of philosophy lets see: "theory" "assumption" "inquiry" just to name a few. The mere fact that you use philosophers to try to prove your point really only proves mine...that reincarnation is only theory, not fact.
I guess nothing can stop you from saying reincarnation is a fact and has been proven and there is no doubt in the world that it is real etc. Anyone can really say anything they want about anything else. So I can say that a person who believes reincarnation is fact is a complete idiot. I try to remain open minded about such things and as critical as I am about reincarnation, I don't totally deny it COULD be possibly, but it has certainly not been proven.
I'm not trying to offend, so don't take anything personally. I just like to argue, it entertains me. I think my opinion is far superior to yours, and I'm sure you feel quite the opposite, so I suppose the best thing to do is agree to disagree for now.
Speaking of, read my philosophy on reincarnation is the post above if you haven't already, you may get a kick out of it
Anyway. I said it before and I'll say it again. EVIDENCE does not equal PROOF. They are two entirely separate things. I don't doubt you can provide me with enough evidence of reincarnation to keep me occupied for 10 lifetimes (pun intended:laugh: ) but evidence doesn't provide concrete proof and reincarnation shouldn't be presented as scientific fact because it isn't. I'm not saying it isn't even real. I have know idea, it very well could be. I'm just saying there is no proof it is. Just because one doctor studies it (or a million doctors for that matter), and provides a lot of good evidence that it could be true, and you and I'm sure millions of other people think it is true, doesn't mean it is true. Secondly, philosophy don't amount to shit in this world. I like philosophy, I suppose I'm a philosopher myself, but what any philosopher says doesn't mean shit. In fact, I'll give you some synonyms of philosophy lets see: "theory" "assumption" "inquiry" just to name a few. The mere fact that you use philosophers to try to prove your point really only proves mine...that reincarnation is only theory, not fact.
I guess nothing can stop you from saying reincarnation is a fact and has been proven and there is no doubt in the world that it is real etc. Anyone can really say anything they want about anything else. So I can say that a person who believes reincarnation is fact is a complete idiot. I try to remain open minded about such things and as critical as I am about reincarnation, I don't totally deny it COULD be possibly, but it has certainly not been proven.
I'm not trying to offend, so don't take anything personally. I just like to argue, it entertains me. I think my opinion is far superior to yours, and I'm sure you feel quite the opposite, so I suppose the best thing to do is agree to disagree for now.
Speaking of, read my philosophy on reincarnation is the post above if you haven't already, you may get a kick out of it
Wow claycad, you are quite contemptous, aren't you? And the inaccuracy of your presumptions are equal to that amount of contempt. First of all, check to see if you have a reading comprehension problem. I stated clearly that it is by no means fact, you even quoted it in your sig!
Also, definition of evidence: "something that furnishes proof", so if you have evidence you have proof. However, I admit I used "evidence" in the wrong context, so that renders this particular debate nonsensical.
I do not believe in reincarnation per say, just that I keep an open mind considering all of the extensive research that is done.
As for your opinion being far superior to mine, by all means think that. I've had quite a few educated people state that I am exceedingly intelligent, so I do think quite the opposite you're right.
"So I can say that a person who believes reincarnation is fact is a complete idiot."
Hmm, the use of the word idiot implies a lack of intelligence. I am reminded of an egyptian proverb "No one is in the position to judge his neigbor's intelligence, his vital experience is never his neighbor's."
Your opinion seems quite arrogant and narrow-minded, I think I will exit this debate before it goes any further.
BTW, yes, you are totally confused...
Also, definition of evidence: "something that furnishes proof", so if you have evidence you have proof. However, I admit I used "evidence" in the wrong context, so that renders this particular debate nonsensical.
I do not believe in reincarnation per say, just that I keep an open mind considering all of the extensive research that is done.
As for your opinion being far superior to mine, by all means think that. I've had quite a few educated people state that I am exceedingly intelligent, so I do think quite the opposite you're right.
"So I can say that a person who believes reincarnation is fact is a complete idiot."
Hmm, the use of the word idiot implies a lack of intelligence. I am reminded of an egyptian proverb "No one is in the position to judge his neigbor's intelligence, his vital experience is never his neighbor's."
Your opinion seems quite arrogant and narrow-minded, I think I will exit this debate before it goes any further.
BTW, yes, you are totally confused...
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I personally am a Christian. But I dunno what to beleive on SOME things. The only things that have kept me going, the future "happiness" being happy and helping other get better so they can be happy. And I am told that you can't be forgiven for suicide, so I am not sure. I would always think what if it's worse than this when life could get better anyway. But it's scarey not knowing for sure what happens after life. And that I think about a lot. And it does terrify me. My friend "gaurenteed" me I wouldn't go to heaven if I did kill myself. And sometimes I get frustrated with stuff.
Anyway...I am blabbing and bathering and making no sense so I will end my post now. Because I am crazy :bleh:
:hug: to everyone.
Blessings and hugs,
Carolyn.
Anyway...I am blabbing and bathering and making no sense so I will end my post now. Because I am crazy :bleh:
:hug: to everyone.
Blessings and hugs,
Carolyn.
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