Eating Poison

[Dots]

There's a couple different sayings that go something like "being angry is like swallowing poison and hoping the other person will die" or something in that realm. No.. it's not verbatim. Bitterness is a dark abyss.

Do you agree with this sentiment?

Do you agree you should let go of your anger for your own health and well-being? Do you agree bitterness is like a deep, dark void that is hard to climb out of?

There are two inner battles in my head... anger is necessary. People need to stop labeling anger as a wrong, bad and shameful emotion. We are allowed to be angry. We are especially allowed to be justifiably angry. I think it becomes unuseful at the point when you don't process that anger. When the anger doesn't progress into anything but irrational rage. But do I think we need to feel this emotion? Absolutely.

And when anger turns into bitterness, I do think it is like swallowing poison. When you are at the point that everything irritates you, and every little incident feeds your hate and contempt about society, or whatever you choose to be angry about. And because of this you feel no joy or beauty or love. That is hurting you.

My conflicting thought says our anger turns to bitterness because we never get closure, we never get justice, and we never get to act on our rage. For example, if someone wrongs you, do you tell them off? In many cases, I haven't and then I've just suffered. So maybe it's just repressed anger that's turning to bitterness.

Any thoughts?

 

[Aurelia]

I much prefer anger to despair or anxiety. When I'm angry, I don't let my emotions get in the way of logic as much as I do when I'm the latter two. Mostly because when I'm angry, I'm justifiably angry, and along woth that, comes a lack of caring. Whereas if I feel miserable or terrified, I'm much more likely to make stupid decisions. Anger is easier for me to deal with by a long shot. It may not be this way for everyone, but it is for me.

 

[MisterBGone]

I think that you’ve got some very good assessments and ideas in general, there. . . & I hesitate to try to add any component s which might be at all or in any way considered “useful!” but I do think I agree with you on most if not much of what you say. . )if there is a difference there—: I think that it is a very necessary emotion to have, be felt & c & c ... for stuffing it down on the insides and trying to for get about it will likely lead to it only coming out sideways, in the end, most likely on an unintended target . ( ; also feel that this is one area where therapy is supposed to earn their keep, so to speak! In the aid or help of processing these said powerful emotions that have been tied to powerful experience s, some of which may be unresolved from some time ago, others from only yesterday. Either way, they all add up - and we’re left with a “cumulative effect!” (Or bill-).~* so it is in the waste, or wreckage of these episodes of anger & fits of rage, that get transferred over and into / thru our everyday otherwise ordinary and normal circumstances, and that can then tend do, as you say “color,” our perception of things / the outside (& inside!) world. In other words, we’re almost viewing things, through a “dirty,” lens; or better , to mak e a cinematic reference, more like a forced perspective with respect to camera lens choices (such as a super wide-angled lens, that distorts the perception of the reality of the scene, or situation at play). Or as someone else brilliant once said, “we photograph, the photograph..” (that’s all we’re doing here!) j do t really know if I’ve done ✅ any thing to answe ur “?” Or not! But, there it is, theee to u have it, what more is ther to say? We’ve said it all...

 

[dandelion s]

Do you agree you should let go of your anger for your own health and well-being? Do you agree bitterness is like a deep, dark void that is hard to climb out of?

i think there are times when such anger needs to be discarded and then there are times when the anger was prompted by things that need to be dealt with. it is at those times that figuring out how to do it appropriately is a difficult task because you want to discard bad feelings yet unresolution promotes more bad feelings.
i go through this process from time to time but don’t know how successful i am. like were my efforts worth the trouble? i do have strong feelings of bitterness! sometimes they become heightened. i wish i could discard them and i don’t think i do even when my disturbance diminishes and i’m feeling good, it often turns out that the basic problem still exists and just has been set aside and left to fester a bit until something triggers me again.

i know i have many things about my behavior that make this a big issue. i know that my hijacker is a big bit of rage and even now that i’ve discovered this recently i do not seem to have what it takes and be open about it with others so that i can disarm that demon and rage and just be the real me and find happiness.

then, in a totally unrelated thing i’m having my bimonthly red tape issues with government unemployment issues vs. government health insurance issues that clearly do need resolution yet the resolution in their eyes means that to get one benefit i may need to give up the other.

so why am i drawn into this situation. they should have a system that works without all the red tape. i just want my family and self to survive. i did not lose my job voluntarily nor did i bring on the current lack of employment possibilities.

and i realize too how so many are in much worse situations than i am. it stands to reason there is much anger that does need to be processed yet there seems to be little in the way of figuring out how to make that real. (just my present line of reasoning - or lack thereof) .

 

[Dots]

I much prefer anger to despair or anxiety. When I'm angry, I don't let my emotions get in the way of logic as much as I do when I'm the latter two. Mostly because when I'm angry, I'm justifiably angry, and along woth that, comes a lack of caring. Whereas if I feel miserable or terrified, I'm much more likely to make stupid decisions. Anger is easier for me to deal with by a long shot. It may not be this way for everyone, but it is for me.

I never considered this, but anxiety definitely makes me more irrational than anger does.

 

[Dots]

most likely on an unintended target

Very true... and something I'm guilty of.

j do t really know if I’ve done ✅ any thing to answe ur “?” Or not! But, there it is, theee to u have it, what more is ther to say? We’ve said it all...

Lol, you answered my question by agreeing with me. :P Maybe I've said too much in this post and covered all the bases. Though I believe a psychologist once said to me (not my psychologist) that anger is a very juvenile and even stunted emotion because we feel frustrated and angry when our brain doesn't know how else to respond or work through a problem. I didn't explain it very well.. but I completely disagreed at the time, even though they were probably more qualified to evaluate emotions than I was.. and this is what sparked my question.

 

[Dots]

it is at those times that figuring out how to do it appropriately is a difficult task because you want to discard bad feelings yet unresolution promotes more bad feelings.

Yes. This, right here. It is difficult to reach the understanding you need to face the negative emotions to get to the healthy emotions.

A sick little joke, if you ask me.

i know that my hijacker is a big bit of rage and even now that i’ve discovered this recently i do not seem to have what it takes and be open about it with others so that i can disarm that demon and rage and just be the real me and find happiness.

your hijacker? as in what takes over you when you are in a rage? I don't like to be open about my bitterness and anger in me, but I definitely have no problem being angry. In fact, sometimes it feels good.. in a bad way, to kindle the anger and let whatever fly out of my mouth regardless of who it hurts. Even admitting that is hard. I almost deleted it.

so why am i drawn into this situation. they should have a system that works without all the red tape. i just want my family and self to survive. i did not lose my job voluntarily nor did i bring on the current lack of employment possibilities.

I completely agree and this is what I mean by you have the right to be justifiably angry at the way things are. Also, I am sorry you are experiencing this situation where both income and health needs can't be met.

it stands to reason there is much anger that does need to be processed yet there seems to be little in the way of figuring out how to make that real. (just my present line of reasoning - or lack thereof) .

Ok, fair point. You need to process you anger and to do that you need to resolve the issue, but when there is no solution... you can't process the anger and you become angrier. That's why I wonder... should we let it go? But how can you when the anger is regarding your livelihood?

 

[Dante]

I had a reply all written out when I realised something new about anger.

Anger is a primal force, and when describing it, I realised being angry is almost identical to being competitive. Historically when someone wronged you (im talking tribal times and before) if you let it go without making them pay dearly, you would be seen as weak, as someone who could be wronged without repercussion, so when someone wrongs you, your mind immediately recognises a zero-sum game, a competition. Your opponent has taken something from you in one way or another, you need to even the odds, and the only difference between friendly rivalry and anger is the addition of spite, in a competition, when you win, thats it, but when someone wrongs you, you need to make an example so no one tries it again.

As with competition, if you "win" anger (usually by making your opponent suffer disproportionately to how you suffer) then you will feel a cold kind of triumph, a euphoria reaction, coloured by the spite running through all anger responses. If you lose, (usually by the other person not suffering enough) you will feel despair and powerlessness, and as this is not acceptable, you may still feel angry.

I have had more than my fair share of dealings with anger in the past, (anger issues seem to run in the family) and until I came up with an outlet it always came down to 2 options: Let the anger fester, or let it turn into despair.

I put it to you that when someone makes you angry, THEY have poisoned you, it is then up to you to decide the least damaging route to dealing with the poison. You could take no action and let the poison continue to eat at you, or you could find a way to extract the poison (usually by poisoning them right back) or you could convert it into another type of poison which may be easier to deal with.

Being angry isnt a choice, I know this from first hand experience, and just letting too much anger go can drop you into despair which you may not be able to handle. Luckily, anger and competitiveness are very similar, so if you can foster that anger and channel it into something positive, subtract the spite and focus it on something competitive, then I think that's the best way. Thats why people talk about taking anger into sport, it can be a fuel, one that is expended safely.

Now my only problem is that I hate sports

P.s. sorry for the long reply, I tend to do that sometimes when my mind hasnt had an outlet for a while (seriously, im so damned isolated atm its unreal.)

 

[MisterBGone]

Very true... and something I'm guilty of.



Lol, you answered my question by agreeing with me. :P Maybe I've said too much in this post and covered all the bases. Though I believe a psychologist once said to me (not my psychologist) that anger is a very juvenile and even stunted emotion because we feel frustrated and angry when our brain doesn't know how else to respond or work through a problem. I didn't explain it very well.. but I completely disagreed at the time, even though they were probably more qualified to evaluate emotions than I was.. and this is what sparked my question.

And this is, or therein lies one of the classic / primary problem with the field, or study of psychology (& psychiatry). . . It is a very —by pure scientists definitions & standards—“gray science!” though they like to try to make it not so, and the psychologist with which you spoke (not yours, thankfully...) was making an inference, or interpretation - that is a deduction based on what seems to me to be very flawed thinking &/or reasoning. What he said, I feel, as you do too... is not only incorrect—(it almost doesn’t even make sense!). He has taken something that he has formed an opinion on (or she), and then turned it around and stated it as fact. Maybe it is a theory, but I seriously - seriously doubt it..

now, another thought that occurred to me that I was curious about, do you now, or have you ever made it a habit to release this anger? And if so, is it by healthy means (e. g., “exercise?”). Or you could always get a sparring dummy like the ones you see in the sporting goods stores, that have like the upper half or part of the human body! Those might be kind of fun to jump up in the air and spin kick in the head? No!

 

[dandelion s]

your hijacker? as in what takes over you when you are in a rage?

actually i am never in a rage outwardly. i never knew there was a rage at all until maybe about 8 months ago or a year at most. i have been a self harmer all my life and i never knew why. i never knew what the self harm was.

Ok, fair point. You need to process you anger and to do that you need to resolve the issue, but when there is no solution... you can't process the anger and you become angrier. That's why I wonder... should we let it go? But how can you when the anger is regarding your livelihood?

the self harm was unprocessed anger. as i just said, i never knew until recently and that was when i looked at my scars. rage so clearly shows in the scars. buried deep inside me was the real me imprisoned by the shame that rules my life. shame keeps the real me hidden and from openly existing. shame kept the anger from being processed.

but the hidden person was doing whatever it took to try to get out and that was anger and rage. “why are you keeping me in prison?” and the me on the outside named it hijacker but “hijacker” once in a while would tell that the outside me was actually the hijacker. kidnapping who i really am and keeping me locked inside. this is the truth but there is still a battle going on because there is residual shame, maybe habitual, that serves to keep the real me still locked inside.

i have been talking more and more about this lately. there is no valid reason for the shame. the real me needs to be free. the change is going to come because now the anger is being processed so that there will be no more violence. certainly none outwardly ever but the self harm will be ending too.

i can’t say that this is on any kind of a timeline. i’ve spoken around about it and have not gotten any response so talking about it is only with my therapist. but i do see that there is a way out and the anger can finally be quelled.

so yeah, rage does/did take over but the real hijacker is the part of me that locked the real me inside. rage was necessary but that will be reaching resolution very soon.

 

[Dots]

Apologies for being MIA, I just needed a break from the internet and from... life really.

As with competition, if you "win" anger (usually by making your opponent suffer disproportionately to how you suffer) then you will feel a cold kind of triumph, a euphoria reaction, coloured by the spite running through all anger responses. If you lose, (usually by the other person not suffering enough) you will feel despair and powerlessness, and as this is not acceptable, you may still feel angry.

Usually during a competition I am not angry, but prideful and ready, so I'm not sure I associate anger with competition always but I can see how winning could be a release from this feeling.

I put it to you that when someone makes you angry, THEY have poisoned you, it is then up to you to decide the least damaging route to dealing with the poison. You could take no action and let the poison continue to eat at you, or you could find a way to extract the poison (usually by poisoning them right back) or you could convert it into another type of poison which may be easier to deal with.

I don't think anger is always justifiable, so I don't think it is the offender who is poisoning you, but I 100% agree that it is up to you in how you respond to the offense and to the anger. I used to deal with anger through boxing but since I became chronically ill, I've not been able to indulge this release.

Being angry isnt a choice

Yes, perhaps the emotion itself isn't the choice but how you choose to react to and process the emotion is a choice.

P.s. sorry for the long reply, I tend to do that sometimes when my mind hasnt had an outlet for a while (seriously, im so damned isolated atm its unreal.)

Ha, no problem I could write epilogues about these matters. Sorry you're isolated. I'm there with you. Feel free to word vomit all over my posts in the future.

 

[Dots]

sorry for lack of reply. as mentioned above, I needed a break from the internet.

kidnapping who i really am and keeping me locked inside. this is the truth but there is still a battle going on because there is residual shame, maybe habitual, that serves to keep the real me still locked inside.

So the feeling of shame is allowing your hijacker to keep you locked inside. I can relate, but I referred to the hijacker as something else once upon a time...

certainly none outwardly ever but the self harm will be ending too.

I am glad the self harm will be ending. Very glad.

rage was necessary but that will be reaching resolution very soon.

This is good. I hope this means good things for you.

 

[Dots]

He has taken something that he has formed an opinion on (or she), and then turned it around and stated it as fact. Maybe it is a theory, but I seriously - seriously doubt it..

She! And I'm unsure if it was peer reviewed and agreed upon, but I remember that. I do think anger comes from frustration when we can't see a solution but I think it's a very narrow way of looking at a complex emotion.

now, another thought that occurred to me that I was curious about, do you now, or have you ever made it a habit to release this anger?

Ha. Ha.. I used to box, but don't anymore due to medical reasons. :/

 

[MisterBGone]

She! And I'm unsure if it was peer reviewed and agreed upon, but I remember that. I do think anger comes from frustration when we can't see a solution but I think it's a very narrow way of looking at a complex emotion.



Ha. Ha.. I used to box, but don't anymore due to medical reasons. :/

I wonder if there’s something else that you could do, more safely, (physically) - that might allow you to... get that same thing / release??

 

[Dots]

I wonder if there’s something else that you could do, more safely, (physically) - that might allow you to... get that same thing / release??

does mental gymnastics count? :P They say swimming, but... I haven't been able to bring myself to since my fiance left for Europe.

 

[MisterBGone]

does mental gymnastics count? :P They say swimming, but... I haven't been able to bring myself to since my fiance left for Europe.

Probably, depending on some particulars—extracurriculars & whatnot! ; ) j/k.. hey! Swimming 🏊‍♀️ s great— I used to love doing it all the time: it was much easier for me to do than most other like things, but I’m sorry to hear for your fiancée s absence - that’s not exactly a jump, and a throw away (or is it , hoop skip & a- ? ).., but yes—id absolutely 100% recommend it my friend! And believe me—the hardest part, is sometimes just getting your butt, “in the pool!” When I used to go regularly, I’d always be reminded of that conversation a couple of my favorite film 🎞 makers had with one another when discussing, what they thought 💭 was the hardest part about directing a film, and one said... “getting out of the car!”

 

[Sunday16]

Great topic @the.end.ish
Anger is a necessary emotion and should not be dismissed or shamed. I've found that anger helps me understand when someone has crossed one of my boundaries. I don't like to act upon my anger though, as I can be mean, and when I speak while angry, it's usually not productive. But I agree with you that sometimes not expressing anger can make it turn into bitterness. If I react when I'm angry I feel a temporary relief, but usually regret it later. I'm learning how to deal with my anger in a healthier way. For me, that means not reacting. Instead I chose to disengage, walk away, then journal my feelings in order to process my anger. Reacting to people with anger has never helped or solved any situation for me. So I believe that feeling anger is perfectly normal, healthy and fine, it's how we react to it that we each need to figure out for ourselves. But I do think not immediately reacting is a good place to start.

 

[Dots]

Hi Sunday

Instead I chose to disengage, walk away, then journal my feelings in order to process my anger. Reacting to people with anger has never helped or solved any situation for me.

I don't think it has solved any situation for me either other than to let the other person know they have upset me. My words said in anger may have won the debate, but they've never dissolved tensions. I think based on what you and others have said, it's good to process your anger and respond instead of not saying anything or saying everything in the moment.

I don't know though. Have you ever had a yelling match with someone and the more you keep going, the more ridiculous it begins to sound and you both end up laughing on the floor?

I think I'll amend my answer to I think it's best to express it, from writing in your journal, to physical release, to talking about it with the offender or even... sometimes fighting. Because at least you're actually talking about it then.

 

[Gonz]

Great topic @the.end.ish
Anger is a necessary emotion and should not be dismissed or shamed. I've found that anger helps me understand when someone has crossed one of my boundaries. I don't like to act upon my anger though, as I can be mean, and when I speak while angry, it's usually not productive. But I agree with you that sometimes not expressing anger can make it turn into bitterness. If I react when I'm angry I feel a temporary relief, but usually regret it later. I'm learning how to deal with my anger in a healthier way. For me, that means not reacting. Instead I chose to disengage, walk away, then journal my feelings in order to process my anger. Reacting to people with anger has never helped or solved any situation for me. So I believe that feeling anger is perfectly normal, healthy and fine, it's how we react to it that we each need to figure out for ourselves. But I do think not immediately reacting is a good place to start.

Yeah, I'm gonna bring up my wife in yet another thread now, but I'll give an example of what I mean when I say that she and I were each other's coping mechanism.

Having her allowed me to express anger in a healthy fashion.

There needs to be a middle ground between just exploding in anger, shouting, maybe getting violent (I would say that there are times when such a reaction is justified, when one has been severely wronged, but that it is rarely a good idea despite that) and thinking that one should not feel or express anger at all (which leads to, as mentioned above, intense bitterness).

So back to my wife; when I was angry about something she'd take me out of the house for a walk to burn off some energy, and to talk about it. And she'd let me talk, even if I wasn't really making sense, without trying to interrupt or argue with me, just maybe sometimes asking questions for clarity. And if she agreed with me, she'd say so, say that, yeah, she'd be angry too. And if she didn't agree with me, she'd let it go for the moment, then give me her perspective when I was in a better state of mind.

And talking to her, if you imagine anger as an overinflated balloon, talking to her was like like making a little pinprick near the knot and letting the air out slowly rather than just popping it by shouting or taking a swing at someone. And it may not be as immediately gratifying as just popping that anger balloon, but at least it doesn't run the risk of scaring the shit out of everyone around you.

 

[MisterBGone]

I think that, too, I’m reminded of something my Mom always said, in that it is never good for one to be, “reactionary,” in these given situations. As you not only are more prone to saying things you might otherwise not do, but also doing them (too). . . Have I listened?? What do you think— ;D
And yes! When in the midst of an epic shooting match / or argument/ heated discussion & -or “debate: it seems one can say all kinds of wild things; ranging from completely logical & rational to not-so-much. . ; ) [sometimes all within the same breath] (=