Forgiveness? warning religious question

Discussion in 'I Have a Question...' started by Terry, Apr 8, 2007.

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  1. Terry

    Terry Antiquities Friend Staff Alumni

    A question for the christians among us.
    We must forgive, but when does forgiveness reach its zenith?
    When someone manipulates and lies to peeps over and over again, hurting and scaring everyone in the process where do we draw the line?
    Given that this person has issues and I believe that the lies and manipulation is part of their illness and condition. How many times do we forgive them and welcome them back into our lives?

    I was angry but the anger has passed and I am just left with a profound sense of sadness and a feeling of 'whatever'. but at the same time I know everytime this manipulation occurs someone I care for gets hurt and triggered and that I will get angry with this person again and again. I am tired of being angry and tired of giving them second, third and fourth chances, but we must forgive...no?:unsure:
     
  2. Terry

    Terry Antiquities Friend Staff Alumni

    Okay just watched 'King of Kings', guess no matter what we forgive :eek:hmy:
    Damn hard tho :sad:
     
  3. ~PinkElephants~

    ~PinkElephants~ Senior member

    I believe that after forgiving someone so many times and giving them so many chances forgiveness seems pointless the fifth and sixth time. I do believe that a person deserves a second chance and deserves forgiveness but if the person keeps committing the same "crime" than saying sorry and forgiving for me alone seems pointless b/c the first sorry meant nothing.

    I dont know if that makes sense but yea...who knows?!
     
  4. kindtosnails

    kindtosnails Staff Alumni

    I think forgiveness is definitely the best path, anger and hatred will just consume you. Maybe you could try and look at the reasons behind why this person is doing whatever they are doing, and understand it so that you can either help them better or make your peace with it and move on. Hope you're ok :unsure: :hug: :hug:
     
  5. Terry

    Terry Antiquities Friend Staff Alumni

    I hate feeling manipulated:sad:
     
  6. ~PinkElephants~

    ~PinkElephants~ Senior member

    Terry
    Manipulation is a tough thing to figure out. You have to really sit back, think and see if the person is really out just to manipulate you. If they are I say it is best, as sad as that may be, to try and remove yourself from that situation and remove yourself from that person's life if only for the time being. I don't like seeing you upset and if the person is manipulating you I say back away and take care of you. You are more important that this person.
    :hug:
     
  7. Terry

    Terry Antiquities Friend Staff Alumni

    I can handle the manipulation of me but they take others down who can't. :mad: :sad:
     
  8. kindtosnails

    kindtosnails Staff Alumni

    Forgive them, yes. But you don't have to welcome them back into your life to hurt you and manipulate you over and over. If they're hurting you/others close to you, then that's not right. Can't you get some space from the situation?
     
  9. Marshmallow

    Marshmallow Staff Alumni

    I'm guessing i know what this is over. Guessing from the msn message i had from you this morning i take it your not very happy. :sad: I'm athiest but wanna share my views on forgiveness.

    I believe everyone should be given a second if their willing to change themselfs. Theres only so many chances you can give. I gave out several chances to my brother and its at the point where i can forgive and forget, its gone too far.

    A few people in my life are probably on their last chance from me. Guess i'm just a push over and a few people around me can wrap me round their little finger. So i tend to forgive them over and over no matter how much i get hurt. It hurts to see people being hurt over and over. Until someone can see what their doing or is willing to change then i guess you can't do anything. If you keep forgiving it's hurt over and over again. Some people are just natural forgiving i guess but i deffiantly think theres a line where you just can't forgive anymore.
     
  10. Fluffy

    Fluffy Well-Known Member

    It's an incredibly hard one, and as a Christian it's one that I struggle with a lot sometimes. How do we find it within ourselves to forgive those who have hurt us / our loved ones in some of the worst ways, or those who keep hurting us over and over again in the same way. I'm afraid my brain is a tad addled this evening so exact references are going to escape me, but somewhere Jesus is asked 'how many times should I forgive' and the answer, as you say, is "every time that forgiveness is asked". However I think that the codicil to this is that we don't need to keep ourselves in a position where we can be constantly manipulated by someone who we can see is going to keep causing us hurt - for example when Abraham and Lot quarelled in Genesis, they decided to both go their separate ways rather than continue to argue and cause more upset. And sometimes, hard as it is, we have to do this - walk away in love, before the situation causes us more bitterness than it does already. Because once the bitterness sets in, it is incredibly hard to work through it, and it is a horrible thing.
     
  11. Terry

    Terry Antiquities Friend Staff Alumni

    Very true Fluff. and yes Viks it is about that. Getting googled to be told about the pills was the fecking icing on the cake!!!
    Don't you be getting upset she aint bloody worth it :mad:
     
  12. ~PinkElephants~

    ~PinkElephants~ Senior member

    I swear if its who i think it is hurting you two ima kick her ass. :eek:hmy: ill save money just to go there. :dry:
     
  13. Marshmallow

    Marshmallow Staff Alumni

    Terry, just leave it. I'll deal with it, don't want you getting angry again.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 8, 2007
  14. Terry

    Terry Antiquities Friend Staff Alumni

    Viks u shouldnt have to be dealing with it..why is sorry such an empty bloody word!!!! Sorry my arse!!!!
     
  15. Marshmallow

    Marshmallow Staff Alumni

    Well i am. Ya know me, i can't just walk away from peeps i care about no matter how much it hurts to see people like this. Will talk to ya later if im around.

    :hug:
     
  16. theleastofthese

    theleastofthese SF Friend Staff Alumni

    I think forgiveness is as much for, if not more for, the forgiver than the forgiven. It's to rid yourself of the anger and hurt so it doesn't eat you up inside. Forgive - yes, forget - never. I'll forgive someone for a wrong done to me but will not forget it as that might leave me open to having it done to me again.

    least
     
  17. Terry

    Terry Antiquities Friend Staff Alumni

    Least thats it in a nutshell, once I forgive completely, twice I forgive most of it, by the umpteenth time have to say my patients is at an end.I do forgive it but I wont forget or really want anything more to do with the person concerned.
     
  18. poison

    poison Well-Known Member

    Hmm... God forgives someone over and over again... you could be a murder, murdered over 20 people, and the bible says, "If you repent, all your sins are erased and forgotten." But, I think things are much different in reality... not to offend anyone.

    Honestly, it comes to a point to where apologies don't mean anything and forgiving the person is sometimes letting them get away with murder. I think you need to learn to draw the line and recognize someone as a friend or foe. Also, I believe I should add I am an atheist but I used to be a Christian and I definitely can see where you are coming from.
     
  19. Adeline

    Adeline Well-Known Member

    I think that there is only a certain amount of times that you can forgive someone. I think that if they have an illness you have to make allowances fo them but it is important to take care of your own feelings first and foremost in that situation. Don't allow yourself to be hurt by someone who can't control themselves. Protect yourself and have your boundaries. It doesn't mean that you have to block them out of your life completely. You can forgive them and have boundaries that they can't cross. Just make sure that you don't have to bear the brunt of their lies and manipulation. God will understand. :smile: Hope that helps.
     
  20. Sa Palomera

    Sa Palomera Well-Known Member

    In my opinion, in this case, the person should not be forgiven.
     
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