I dont know what I want or need from here

Discussion in 'Suicidal Thoughts and Feelings' started by Gatsby, Sep 27, 2011.

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  1. Gatsby

    Gatsby New Member

    About a year ago I started to feel really depressed. This got gradually worse over a period of 6 months. I look at the pictures of me in those 6 months where Im not smiling at all and you can compare them to my old photos where Im usually laughing and having fun. Then, in April this year, something happened that completely devastated me. I havent cried since I was 11 years old, but for a couple of months I cried myself to sleep almost every night. I cant describe this. It was just uncontrollable, painful, wretching and sobbing because of the pain I was in that would only stop when I was so exhausted I fell asleep.

    Im 27 and I hope you dont think Im being arrogant when I say this, but Im well educated (2 degrees in rational/logical subjects I might add), make a good living, am relatively good looking and have a good number of friends. But, I feel like I cant tell any of my friends. Firstly, because I dont think any of them would appreciate it. They'd all feel a burden or a pressure to respond, and I dont want to put that on any of them. If you tell a friend and then you commit suicide, that friend will constantly wonder if there was anything more they could have done. And I dont want that for them. Secondly, because they'd never understand how someone with such a 'good' life wants to kill themselves. Im pretty sure none of them have any clue of what Im considering doing. Except my mum. I can tell that she knows from the way she speaks to me. Theres a resignation in her voice that she can see whats happening to me but she doesnt know how or what to ask. Plus, despite all my friends, Im pretty sure that if I left home tomorrow and didnt contact anyone it would take at least a week, maybe two before I got a text, email or phone call from anyone asking what happened to me. I am completely unnecessary and unnoticeable in their lives. Theres actually one person Id consider telling for a variety of reasons, but for the past 3 months Ive been desperately trying to get in contact with her and she wont even acknowledge I exist. I cant tell her the reason why I want to talk, because I dont want someone to feel they have to talk to me because of the subject matter.

    In the past few months Ive tried really hard to throw myself in to certain things to make myself happier and feel less desperate and alone. Joining new sports teams or putting myself in new social situations. Each time, I fail and it just convinces me more that Im completely useless. I downloaded a suicide manual off the internet about 5 months ago and Ive been studying the various ways of doing it.

    Of course I recognise that by taking my own life I will transfer everything that I feel right now on to 2 people (my immediate family) in particular. But the alternative is trying to bear this pain for the next 40 years of my life until I die naturally. It hasnt gone away, its been just as intense yesterday as it was 3 or 5 months ago. I cant see how things are going to get better. My social circle is closed. All of my friends are getting engaged, married or having kids. If I cant improve my life now, when Im relatively young and have little responsibilities, I dont see how its going to get easier when Im 35 or 45. I hate having to choose between these two since neither is desirable.

    I honestly dont know what I want or expect from posting this which is why I havent asked any questions. I am normally so good at knowing my own mind and thinking through problems but I feel so lost and confused lately. I got here for what is probably the 3rd or 4th time and just felt I needed to post all of this. I know the rules of this forum state you cant provide advice, but I am determined to make sure that this will be a one time only thing so I dont live on in an even worse state than currently and I dont leave a mess for people to clean up after me. Id go to my doctor, but firstly hes been the family friend for over 30 years and my doctor since I was born. Im well aware of the hippocratic oath but I almost see him as a family member and again it puts him in an awful situation when he has to speak to my family when Im gone. Secondly, Im sure there are drugs that make you feel 'normal.' But some part of me thinks that needing drugs to feel normal just proves that there is something fundamentally wrong with me.
  2. total eclipse

    total eclipse SF Friend Staff Alumni

    Secondly, Im sure there are drugs that make you feel 'normal.' But some part of me thinks that needing drugs to feel normal just proves that there is something fundamentally wrong with me.

    If correcting a chemical in your brain can make you live a normal life what is stopping you stress can cause a decrease in dopamine seratonin levels you may just have to take them for a few months until levels are up again. It is the same for a diabteic who has to take insulin because they are not producing enough does that make their lives not worth living
    If medication can bring you back to that person who is smiling and enjoying life then that person is you hun Medication bring back your life you once had that all Like stated sometimes you only have to be on meds until your level go back to NORMAL and you become you again hugs
  3. In Limbo

    In Limbo Forum Buddy


    I think the first thing I'd say is that depression is an illness. You don't have to justify having it. You wouldn't have to justify cancer or alzheimer's so why depression? Depression is irrational and thus it doesn't have a target audience - it can strike anyone from any any background.

    As to the rule about not providing advice - the ignorance of that one is so flagrant throughout the forum it should really be changed...

    With that in mind some initial thoughts to give before I slope off to bed - it being nearly 4am...

    *Find a way to release some of the tension by talking. Be it through helplines such as Samaritans, forums like this, or people you can trust. Putting it out there even to an anonymous voice on a phone can be very theraputic.

    *Keep in regular healthy routine with regard to diet and sleep pattern. If you can get your physical health in a good place, mental healing becomes easier. If you can manage, do some form of physical activity - even if it's just walking to the shops.

    *Talk to your doctor - seek advice from the real professionals! He should be able to live with the patient confidentiality laws and keep your problems to himself - if you're uncomfortable with this then ask if there's another doctor at the surgery you can see. Heck, if he's a family friend then tell him you'd be more comfortable with another doc!

    *Treat yourself. Do some things to make yourself feel good - eat something you like, watch something that makes you laugh, call a friend. Whatever it is - you deserve to feel better even if you don't realise or appreciate it.

    *Try not to predict people's reactions to your being in a bad place. I think this is one of the things that holds us back when we go through big periods of down. We think we'll be a burden or a problem, but to those who love us - we are worth that time. If someone cuts you off for mental illness then that's either out of fear or just being shallow.

    I hope that can be of some help, if it's not - or you wanna talk more then drop me a PM - can't guaruntee an instant response but a response will be forthcoming.

    Much love,
  4. Raphael1

    Raphael1 Well-Known Member

    Even though it may temporarily increase dopamine, which could help to feel better. I see two issues. Firstly, the cause of the problem is not being adressed or fixed only a symptom of it. But more importantly, after an artificial increase in dopamine in the brain from a drug, it will become dependant on the drug to be able to produce more, and will actually inhibit the brains ability to produce dopamine naturally then. The more the drug is taken the more is needed to produce the dopamine and the less capable it becomes of producing it. Atleast thats my understanding of it.

    woudlnt it be best to just deal with the stress or the main cause of it, and the body will recover naturally. Then you don't damage your brain and cause more problems.

    If it was as simple as taking a pill to increase dopamine, everyone would do it to make themself feel great. But there is a catch and a drawback to when you do that.
    Look at ecstasy for example and what it does to the brain. Even though when you first take it it makes you feel great. Its just as bad as drinking like a temporary escape but it doesnt solve anything in my opinion it adds to the problem.

    Only say this cause i have looked at drugs carefully and this is what I came to realize.

    There is medications that can keep serious conditions at bay like when voices are making your life unliveable and bad cases of bi-polar disorder. in these cases it can be appropriate and benificial.
    But generally the average jo, it's only a dis-service to them when they are going through a time of crisis, to start medicating them with pharmaceutical drugs.

    When you are grieving a family members death do you go on anti-depressants? I wouldn't. In some cases it's natural you find more healthy ways to deal with it.

    I know you are a moderator and thanks for helping and caring about people but i had to say this cause i think its pushing drugs too much and depending on them to solve things that they dont in the long term solve.

    It would be possible to make really good medications but not with a monetary system that is motivated by how much profit is gained. With this motivation the sicker the person the more profit it is to them. So the kind of drugs on the market are only the ones making the most money.Not which ones are best or the best treatments. Sad but true.
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 28, 2011
  5. total eclipse

    total eclipse SF Friend Staff Alumni

    Rapheal you are not educated when it comes to medication and how it helps obiviously or you would not be making such statements. There has been many i repeat many people cured from depression with medication and therapy they go on to lead a life that they once lead before the depression set in .

    Be very careful in what you are stating here as you do not fully understand how medication works
    One does not get addicted to antidepressants. This medication replaces a chemical that is not at a normal level for the brain to function As stated the same with diabetes meds are give to replace insulin that is not being made by the pancreas would you tell a diabetic to stop taking their meds NO because the would die with out it and so do some people with depression if untreated they do commit suicide.
    Many have gone on antidepressant to get them through rough times and come off them and moved on. Yes some have to stay on them because they are not able to produce the dopamine or serotonin on their own not because they are addicted to them. Do not discourage the use of medication when it can and does save lives and also give people back their lives the way they use to have it . There are therapy that can help some but some do need medication to heal
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 28, 2011
  6. Anneinside

    Anneinside Well-Known Member

    Thanks Total Eclipse, I couldn't have said it better. Depression often requires medication in order to get over it. Fifty percent of people who have depression for the first time never get it again after having medication for awhile. There is definitely hope if you agree to medication.
  7. total eclipse

    total eclipse SF Friend Staff Alumni

    Exactly that is why one needs to know what they are saying hugs to y ou
  8. Raphael1

    Raphael1 Well-Known Member

    Have you researched about anti-depressants their effectiveness and appropriate use? Cause I have, And what I said is true.

    Its not the same as giving insulin to a diabetic because the brain and how it functions is different.


    You accuse me of not being educated. But you are the one saying about the chemical imbalance theory, which is not even proven. So there is an entire article on it from an organization whos purpose is to help educate and empower people. That is a non-profit health organization.
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 28, 2011
  9. WildCherry

    WildCherry Staff Member ADMIN

    Meds can and do work in certain situations, but like anything else, it's not 100% successful. But just a reminder, this thread isn't here to argue for or against medication. Treatment is up to the individual involved and their health care provider.

    Have you considered therapy, to try and talk through what's happening and get to the root of what's causing you to feel so bad?
  10. total eclipse

    total eclipse SF Friend Staff Alumni

    Gatsby please talk to your doctor okay he or she will help you get the proper treatment you need to heal okay
    Medication can and does help especially if you use it with therapy It is proven that doing both together you will increase your chances of beating this illness
    I do hope you talk to your doctor okay hun Please give yourself a chance don't shut any doors until you have discussed them with your professional
    Hugs to you
  11. Kaos General

    Kaos General Well-Known Member

    Im only talking about myself but medication doesnt help me in the slightest as they make me worse. Ive improved my own condition without the use of meds, its hard as hell but i somehow manage to make it work. Sure medication can and does help a vast swathe of people but i gotta say raphael makes a very good point.

    There has been many i repeat many people cured from depression with medication and therapy they go on to lead a life that they once lead before the depression set in .

    Anti-depressants isnt a cure for depression, it alleviates the symptoms. If people have claimed to have been 'cured' from depression by use of medication then i would have to question whether they had depression in the first place.
  12. total eclipse

    total eclipse SF Friend Staff Alumni

    As stated this is not a thread about meds okay it is a thread of Gatsby reaching out for help because of state of mind she or he is in Someone that is so fragile needs professional help and being so fragile meds do help you get over that crisis state depression is treatable with help hun you can beat this You listen to your doctor okay you talk to your doctor and get help now hun hugs
  13. Kaos General

    Kaos General Well-Known Member

    Yes and telling someone medication is an option is not supportive in the slightest. Telling people who are in a vulnerable state such things is only going to make them goto the doctor and ask for them when they may or may not help. Such advice and support should only be given out by someone trained in such things and not by someone on some forum as it is dangerous. Do what you will with my post, im leaving this thread.
  14. total eclipse

    total eclipse SF Friend Staff Alumni

    Exactly going to a doctor or a professional is where one needs to go to get help please medication is an option as well as therapy keep an open mind okay hun it is your decision in the end what can or will help you but don't rule out anything .
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 28, 2011
  15. Isabel

    Isabel Staff Alumni

    Totally in agreement with TE. I wish I had not resisted so long using meds to get me through depression. I got myself to the point I could not function at all and had to be committed. If I had not been so leery and close minded about getting help sooner, I would have been better of for it. So Gatsby, from what I gathered of your post, you have much in your life going for you. There is every reason to believe that when you feel hopeless, its the depression doing all the talking, no matter how rational you feel about it at the moment. You just need to reach out for help and find the right combination of therapies that will work for you.
  16. peacelovingguy

    peacelovingguy Well-Known Member

    Wow - 27 is young gatsby - but its natural to want to settle down - maybe have your own family - because work - you don't want to be married to that!

    Well - with depression - its hard opening up to people so its understandable that you might have even close friends but would never say anything. I'd not say anything myself - we don't have to tell the world - but its nice to have have someone to relate to.

    Many people with depression will throw themselves into work and avoid relationships. Or maybe keep things casual which is ok when your young maybe - but you need an emotional connection with depression eventually.

    Well if all your mates are marrying and getting engaged you might feel left out a little - but don't think its a competition to get hitched - main thing is to make sure WE are doing as well as we can before we get involved. I don't think its a good idea for anyone depressed to throw themselves into anything - but at the same hand - anything can happen - you might meet someone tonight - tomorrow - and do sound quite a catch for some younger guy out there!

    Glad you have an education - and not in social sciences which - some of them you could take LSD and write a thesis and be praised.

    As for meds - chemicals do play a BIG part in how the brain works. There are drugs that work - but the brain is capable of producing chemicals by its own self and I guess some people might not be able to produce them naturally. Sure its not as simple as diabetes - anti depression meds in 50 years will be way advanced - likely tailor made - but it scares me IF we can be made 'happy' all the time via a pill. I'd rebel - most would jump at it - I guess I'd be suspicious and live in the hills and see what happens.

    Anyhow - you got options Gatsby and life right now - its not how it will always be. Don't ruminate on what everyone else has so much - it will only get you down and you'll hate yourself for feeling bad about other people's happiness.

    I guess you just need a little confidence - maybe not meds - but as stated here - if you feel like dying - no harm in popping a few pills to see if they help. You can stop if they are not working - its easy to do really.

    IF I felt I was going to do myself in - I'd take drugs to live - I mean, that's got to be logical.

    But I don't use meds - and have to use a wide variety of strategies to help me survive and prosper!

    good luck Gatsby - thanks for opening up - you articulate yourself very well and I think its brave of you to tell us how you feel.

    Suicide - its not the answer - you don't want to hurt others - or yourself - and trust me - life will get better - I mean, you got a lot going for you - and when you get on top of the depression that will be a great advantage. Now - it might mean nothing - but keep that job and hopefully being busy is better than watching daytime TV and is good for the healing process.

    Your doctor - is a doctor - the Hippocratic oath or similar applies. You have the option of seeing another doc if you are uncomfortable speaking to this one.

    Hope you are feeling a bit better today.

    My good wishes and prayers.

  17. Raphael1

    Raphael1 Well-Known Member

    I've made my point. But i will say one last thing please then i will leave it. I posted that article and mentioned about medication because I think its highly relevant to the overall support here, so I'm not sure how one could say its not about discussing the medication. Expecially when the majority of post by TE is merely saying go to your doctor and get medication! Yet we need to be reminded not to discuss about it on a thread because it's not about that? Then why is it mentioned all the time? Being informed about the drugs you are thinking about taking or suggesting to people on the forum is pretty relevant to expressing the consequences of actually taking the medication. There is different situations for everyone and not all should be suggested meds by default. Expecially knowing so little about them.

    Don't get me wrong Im not against medication at all. But I'm against overly pushing it on people and using it as the major response to a cry for help on a forum, in which is suppose to be more about discussing their situation in life and different ways of dealing with it in particular in a more personal way. Just general empathizing. Rather than just putting up a sign that says, go to doctor and get medicated with therapy. That's easy to say to anyone. They are not stupid they know about doctors and therapists.

    So people come here for support and love, to discuss and understand about their situation and suffering mostly. To find opinions and feedback, and one on one support in general that is personal. In which they dont nessasarily need to pay for a therapist to get. That is why I thought the forum exists! They can go to a doctor therapist or get their meds whenever they need to. This is a forum to discuss about them and things that are effecting them. Since this is all about helping people and what is best for people here. Its highly relevant.

    And yeah its all well and good to suggest about seeking professional help.
    But isnt that obvious? And there is nothing irrelevant about what I posted.

    yes it is a thread about Gatsby reaching out for help. Obviously, That is why im providing information and assistance on what i think about medication and what is best to assist them. If thats not appropriate than Im not quite sure the forum would be serving it's proper function. And im not to blame if someone debates me when my opinion is different to theirs. That always happens and we should be allowed to each say our opinion on it.

    It's not like there is any name calling or disrespect, or anything else inappropriate other than the original posters best interest in mind here.

    I respect everyones right for an opinion and say on it. As long as they are not being rude or disrespectful and honestly trying to help. But when someone warns me against expressing my own view. That in fact is when it becomes inappropriate.

    Gatsby I hope you get something out of this thread and I wish you all the best.

    And I would stick up for anyone that has an opinion on here, even if I did not agree with them, that they have a right to express it.
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 29, 2011
  18. Acy

    Acy Mama Bear - TLC, Common Sense Staff Member Safety & Support

    My 2 cents on this...

    Regardless of the illness or disorder, a patient owes it to him- herself to become educated on options and various treatments and combinations of treatments. This includes becoming knowledgeable about the expected benefits and the possible side effects of any meds; however, the patient should be asking the doctor and/or pharmacist, reading the product monograph, visiting the company's website, or the government approval and warnings/adverse effects site. It's not anyone's call here to say or have others say one treatment should/should not be used. SF staff and members are peer to peer support, not physicians with patients.

    We can freely suggest that they talk to their doc and/or therapist about meds, therapy, CBT, DBT, etc., but you and your doctor(s) need to discuss your specific situation to determine what option(s) is(are) best for you. In your discussion with your doctor, remember to ask about side effects and risks associated with any treatment plan.
  19. Gatsby

    Gatsby New Member

    Im very grateful for the replies. I dont know who you people are or why you freely choose to read and help people in this forum. But I am grateful that you do. Just to be clear, because it seems it wasnt from my post, I am actually male.

    I didnt expect to start a discussion on medication. Personally, I feel as though medication isnt the answer for several reasons. Obviously, I worry about the doctor situation. But I also worry that once I start Ill never be able to stop. Im not an expert, but I thought depression was uncurable. I dont want to take pills for the rest of my life. I worry that others (and importantly myself) will never view me as being 'normal' because I have to take pills in order to be ok.

    Samaritans/Doctor - Id have a really hard time speaking about this. I know it is wrong and I even know that certain charities have been trying to change this attitude for the last decade, but I feel afraid to admit to having depression for obvious reasons. It was hard enough to admit to myself and write about how I feel. Speaking about it is something Im not sure I can do because then it seems even more real.

    I actually do a lot of sports. When Im playing I do have fun. But in some ways playing just reminds me of my shortcomings. I see the people in the teams I play with organising to meet up or go out. I dont want to invite myself along. If Im asked Ill always say yes. But I rarely get an explicit invite. I feel as though I know many many people to say hi to, have a short conversation with and so on, but basically have nobody who is a real friend. I even sometimes think that my close group of friends, who Ive known since high school, only continue to invite me to nights out and holidays out of courtesy. I cant remember the last time I got a phone call or message from someone just to say hi or ask what I was upto.

    I agree completely with you that if people react in a certain way it says something about their character. I met someone a year ago that told me she had tried to commit suicide twice in the past. I helped her and I check in with her every now and then to make sure shes ok and she tells me she is happy. Im always willing to put myself out for someone if its that important, but I wonder whether the people Ive chosen as friends are the same. One of my friends was part of a bomb disposal team in Afghanistan, working there over christmas, only me and 1 other person sent him an xmas card/present. I guess I fear telling my friends and finding out they arent the people I thought they were as well as all the other reasons. Like I knew how to react when that girl told me, because Id received training on similar situations since I used to be a teacher (before selling myself out for corporate finance). I cant imagine how my friends would react to hearing the word suicide mentioned.

    The thing Im unsure of in therapy, is do therapists provide solutions to problems or do they just help you to find out what the problems are? Because, I feel as though Im pretty aware of why Im feeling bad.

    27 - I feel old. I had a plan. Get my education, get a good job, meet someone and have a family. I regret a lot of things Ive done and decisions Ive made in my life, but nevertheless Ive ended up with more than my fair share. Im grateful for that. Which is why I beat myself up a little for even having these thoughts.

    Your right about needing a connection. I remember being stood in front of the mirror with a razor blade in my hand when I was 17. Nobody knows about that. I went to uni and met a girl, not in a romantic way but kind of like a brother/sister relationship. She helped me a lot. Then I met someone and was with her for 6 years. Shes the only person Ive ever felt close to telling about the whole thing, but for a variety of reasons I cant tell her now. Life felt bearable during those times and I was happy for large portions of it.

    I dont begrude my friends settling down. Im actually really happy for them. But they start to ring themselves off from us because they want to create their own life together. Thats natural. And I dont hate them for that at all. But how do I find someone when my social options are becoming more and more limited? Thats why Ive been trying to meet new people lately, but I seem to fail even at that. Which makes me even more depressed.
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