Mentally ill patients/cancer patients.

Discussion in 'Suicidal Thoughts and Feelings' started by TooShyToScream, Feb 24, 2011.

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  1. TooShyToScream

    TooShyToScream Well-Known Member

    Personally, I don't think there's much of a difference. Both need constant care and attention. Both are in pain - mentally and physically - only difference is, in cancer patients the physical causes the mental and in mentally ill patients the mental causes the physical. My fiance's mom has been doing pretty bad lately. She has stage 4 cervical cancer and the past few days, she's been really upset, anxious, can't talk, eat, or move much. And I've noticed how my fiance became a lot more caring and aware that this is bad when she took a turn for the worse. He's very attentive and compassionate now because he realizes she's going to die soon. I am suicidal, with mood and personality disorders. I often suffer from depression, anger, and anxiety. And my life is in danger some days as well. With cancer patients, it progressively gets worse (if not treated or too advanced), and with mentally ill patients the same could be true or it could be a rollercoaster, where the person is awful some days and not so bad others. But either way, their life is in danger too. I can't eat, sleep, get up to take a shower, or go to school some days either. And I just feel like he doesn't see the similarities in myself and his mom. He could be just as attentive and compassionate to me too and it would help a lot, but he's not always like that. So I told him that in a lot of ways, I'm just like someone with cancer and need the same things...except that I am still able to function sometimes, but not always...and rarely ever very well. I hope it helps him understand. A lot of his actions have to do with the stigma that physical pain is more real than mental and it's really not.
     
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  2. itmahanh

    itmahanh Senior Member & Antiquities Friend

    I made a thread about the same type of issues a while back. Cancer is widely accepted and the people who suffer it are treated with care and respect. Mental health issues are just as devastating to the person suffering and can be just as fatal as cancer. But we are told things like "suck it up" or "it's all in your head". How many people have said that to someone suffering from cancer? There are physical and emotional effects from mental health issues just as there are physical and emotional effects for those suffering cancer. I dont know why people cant comprehend those facts.

    I suffer mental health issues and have cancer. Both are dragging me through Hell. But no one in RL seems to think my mental health is as important as my physical health. But what they dont realize without good mental health it is really hard to keep up good physical health.

    I am glad that your fiance is there and helping his Mom the best he can. I hope that he will soon realize that you are suffering too. But understandably he is throughing most of his efforts into his Mom. You need to keep posting here so members can give you the support you need :arms:
     
  3. doityourself

    doityourself Well-Known Member

    I have felt this way and thought these exact same thoughts. I do hope that he sees and understands what your feeling, but if hes never been there realize its hard for him to comprehend how hard it is, just to get out of bed, just to say okay Im going to give it another try again and do the same again tomorrow. Its hard, I know.

    Alot of people that have never suffered the way you and I do cant understand how much and maybe choose to ignore it because they think if you dont say anything then they dont want you to think about it, or that is magically gone, but you and I know that never happens. Please be patient with him and yourself, realize life is what we make it.

    Try and retrain your thoughts, to love yourself, to want to live, to want to fight the demons back. Ive been learning new ways to stop these thoughts from coming on, I actually argue with myself in my head, I know that these thoughts are wrong to think and I tell them that, if your like me then we have spent years telling ourselves how much we suck, how much life sucks, but what if we tell ourselves the opposite, give it a try, maybe if we spend the same amount of energy on fighting them and not giving into them we can recover.

    I hope your feeling better and that the down is passing and remember the ups are right around the corner. I know they never last long but really pay attention next time at how you feel and what you achieve when your up. Seeing that makes you want more and crave more, so you will start putting your energy to feeling that way instead of the way you are now.

    Hugs and hoping you feel better.
     
  4. TooShyToScream

    TooShyToScream Well-Known Member

    Itmahanh - It wouldn't be understandable to focus most of his efforts on his mom. Both his mom and I need him equally in terms of care. Yes, if she is in immediate danger and I'm not it would be understandable. But what if I am and she's not? It works both ways.
     
  5. itmahanh

    itmahanh Senior Member & Antiquities Friend

    I'm sure your fiance is runiing on feelings of guilt and that is why he is being so attentive to his mother's needs right now. He sees his mom and knows the cancer can take her anytime. So he is trying desperately to make sure he rights what ever it is that is making him feel guilt. When he looks at his mom it terrifies him to see a parent so fragile, when they are the ones that have always been strong. He sees her dying. But hun when he looks at you, he sees someone who is still strong. I dont think he can see your pain right now. I know you need him too. But realistically he wants to focus on his mom's needs. Maybe tell him that you appreciate all that he is going through with his mom and how important that he be there for her. But when he can sneak a few moments that you would love atleast a special hug or cuddle to remind each other how much you mean to one another.

    It really doesnt matter how much we see both illnesses as similiar to a degree. He cant. He sees his mom dying. That is his priority right now. But it doesnt mean he thinks any less of you or your pain and struggles.
     
  6. TooShyToScream

    TooShyToScream Well-Known Member

    Itmahanh - it absolutely means that...to me, at least. I know he feels guilty for whatever he thinks he did wrong right now, but when his mom dies, he's going to need me more than ever. But if he doesn't keep me stable enough to be here, I can't be here for him. That's what I want him to realize. He probably won't, but if he understands at least a little bit more, that's better than nothing. You say "realistically" he wants to focus on his mom's pain. I hope you mean realistically, to him. Either way, his reality needs to be changed because he's only seeing what he chooses, not the entire picture.
     
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  7. itmahanh

    itmahanh Senior Member & Antiquities Friend

    I'm sorry I dont want to make you feel like I'm picking on you or belittling your situation. But his Mom doesnt have any options anymore with stage 4 cancer. She is dying. Nothing she can do will change that, short of a complete miracle. And your fiance knows that too. She's dying. You still have options and I think your fiance sees that. You may feel like you are being left out or your needs arent being met, but he is about to lose his mom and he knows when that happens that he will have you to be there for him. I think he sees a strength that you dont even know you have. Try to see it from his point of view. I'm assuming (and I hate to do that) that he has been supportive to your needs in the past. So trust him and know he will be again when he can focus on you and not have his mothers needs to meet too. This is going to come out wrong I'm sure, but maybe tend to his needs as a distraction from your struggles right now. Sorry dont know any other way to put it. Maybe by helping him, it will help to push the pain and demons you're fighting back a little bit :arms:
     
  8. TooShyToScream

    TooShyToScream Well-Known Member

    I do help him whenever I am aware that he needs it (though, he doesn't always make me aware, but I constantly tell him to), regardless of whether or not I'm in pain, for that matter. And I don't always get the same in return. He's not always attentive to my needs, and it was no different before he found out about his mom. That's why I say it's a stigma about mental illness, not just a matter of his mom having this disease. As for having options, that's the thing, I won't have them if he doesn't help me. I am suicidal enough that I will kill myself if I feel like he doesn't love me anymore or I'm losing him. And it doesn't even have to be true, I just have to FEEL like it is. I may "have" options but if I'm too mentally fucked up to use them, that's the same as not having them in the first place.
     
  9. TooShyToScream

    TooShyToScream Well-Known Member

    Doityourself - thank you for your response, I couldn't reply right away because I was in class and didn't have time to read your post. I can write a reply on my phone and still look up, but it doesn't work that way with reading :p it does seem that if I convince myself enough of the good things, I'd probably start to believe them...but that's 20 years of negativity and bullshit to fix. I just don't know if I'm up for that. Some days it's too hard to be. I think what I agree with the most is when you said that they think it disappeared if you're not showing direct signs of it. "Oh you were laughing 2 minutes ago, you're fine".okay so because something was funny for a minute I forgot about it, but that doesn't mean it's gone. It comes right back when you're done laughing. Or if you're not directly crying or hurting yourself, it's still there. I still feel like shit. Just, my body's become used to that general feeling of depression and has learned to react only when something worse than the usual is happening as a means of survival - in order to still be able to function sometimes. We have some capacity for pain. When I was getting my tattoo, it hurt like a bitch at first, but an hour later, he was still working on it, I was still feeling the same pain, but I stopped thinking "OMFG this hurts what did I get myself into?". I wouldn't be able to function properly if I kept thinking that for an entire hour. It works the same way with mental illness. At some point you just say "fuck it, it's there. What's new?" That doesn't mean you're okay though.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 24, 2011
  10. doityourself

    doityourself Well-Known Member

    Yep my H is the same way, he said those exact same things to me the other night, just a few minutes ago you were happy why you so pissed now. (mine comes out in anger now)

    I get that way because I let myself get that way, once it starts coming I give in because its so easy just to go with it, and it takes so much to fight whats been there for so many years.

    If we do this, then it means we are giving up on ourselves and how we want to change, not saying Im in a "good" way all the time, but it has lessened over the years, and Ive learned to stop and yes ignore what happened in the past, what brought it all on in the first place, if thats even how it happened or maybe its hereditary, who the hell knows. Ive just gotten fed up to my ears with feeling like crap, with beating myself up over it, with bringing everyone down around me all the time. Its not fair to me or to them.

    So Im doing what I can to change it, dont know if you journal or go to therapy but that helped me alot and to tell the truth it helps being able to come on here and talk to you cause you know how it feels and can relate to it, but I know it can consume you and take over everything, we just have to fight a little harder to stop it or lessen it. And to tell the truth Ive just grown plain tired of being me, so Im changing me into someone I can accept a little better.

    I cant give up, its not in me to fail, and killing myself would mean failure on my part and failing the ones Ive created or have let love me.

    Dont worry about the posting, Im at work so thats why Im on and off, lol. Be patient with me, okay.
     
  11. TooShyToScream

    TooShyToScream Well-Known Member

    I have borderline personality disorder, so I know all about anger. I know what it is to twist people's words into how my brain interprets them, and then hold them accountable for it. I know what it is to get angry at those around me for my feelings. For years I felt like "well, people cause me to have these bad feelings so it must be their fault". Fairly recently, I've realized it's not their fault that my mind produces certain thoughts and feelings. They don't mean to upset me, it just happens because of the way I am. But I've also realized that other people are just as wrong for blaming me for those same feelings. I can't control them. They just happen. The truth is, no one is to blame. Maybe some people from your past are if they've hurt you. But your husband or fiance or boyfriend/girlfriend whom you're with now, 15 -20 years later is not to blame. Yes, it is extremely easy to act on feeling angry, and easy to have someone to blame to feel better about yourself...but I know that in those times I just need to stop and try to think rationally about whose fault, if anyone's it really is, and how I can act in a way that doesn't suppress my feelings, but doesn't damage those of others. And that's the hard part because not only do you have to collect yourself to think rationally at a very inconvenient moment, you also have to use critical thinking to figure out what to do in the matter of a few seconds or minutes. They teach you this stuff in cognitive behavioral therapy and dialectical behavioral therapy but no situation is the same, so it's extremely hard to think about what you learned and apply it. I don't know, I think I've gotten slightly better with that, but I still sometimes snap and act on impulse because it feels so right at the time. The problem is also that the people around you don't know how to help keep you calm properly and sometimes make it worse, even when you've made some progress and done what you were supposed to. And then you feel like it was all worthless. But if you act on impulse, those actions that feel so right at the moment, are going to feel so wrong minutes, hours, or days from now. It's just hard to know what to do. Very much so.
     
  12. doityourself

    doityourself Well-Known Member

    You seem to know alot that took me many of years to get, Ive went through therapy multiple times but have never tried CBT, heck Ive just recently learned about it.

    So the problem is that we can get ourselves smarter and smarter on the issue but need to learn how to control our impulses, Im def the same, I can snap really fast with very little, small things. My H and kids suffer from this, see I have no friends so they are the only ones around me, and the guilt of it eats me up, and that guilt is whats making me open my eyes up and realize that I have to change not only for them but for myself to. Its not fair to them or to me to feel like this all the time.

    In my case I can say its both, heritary and was brought on by actions of others in my childhood, so Ive learned to accept what happened and move past it, I cant change it now so why dwell on it and drive myself crazy.

    I was diagnosed with bipolar and manic depression at 19, but was dealing with the symptons well before then. Im 33 now so Ive had many of years to self analyze and self hate for who and what I am. Now I just want to be something else, and Im trying my damnest to change and overcome this disease, this addiction of self destruction, because I think only I can choose to change or to give up. Somedays I just want to give in, it would seem so much simpler but then I start thinking what about my kids, what about my H. Will I create a rerun of myself in them? Will I damage them as my so called parents did to me? For many years Ive self medicated by drugs, but then started realizing that the drugs are also causing problems, just adding to the bottom line. Now Ive been clean for 31 days today and it feels good to have my head clear and to really think about things.

    Im sorry your dealing with what you have to, and I hate to see anyone suffer, but If I could ask a couple of questions and you have to say the first answer that comes to mind. I will just start and you can ignore me if you want.

    1. Do you REALLY want to die, or do you want to stop suffering?

    2. Have you tried absolutely everything to relieve yourself?

    3. Do you bring on issues that can be avoided?

    4. If you could do anything today to change, would you?

    These are questions I ask myself over and over, sometimes my answwers change but the bottom line is that I do want to live not only for my H and my kids but for me, to see if I can change if I can be that person I crave to be so much.

    The thinking can be so overwhelming, can just drive me looloo, but atleast we are still doing it, still living, still fighting for our lives and until we stop we are still alive, still human, still us. So Im coming to this is me, you get what you get and I have to learn to live with it.
     
  13. TooShyToScream

    TooShyToScream Well-Known Member

    1. Do you REALLY want to die, or do you want to stop suffering?
    I don't think anybody has the will to die unless they are suffering in some way. It's not human nature to want to die.

    2. Have you tried absolutely everything to relieve yourself?
    No, not everything...but a lot of things. Sometimes these options are unattainable though, depending on your situation. And sometimes a person believes they've tried everything, because they've tried everything they know of.

    3. Do you bring on issues that can be avoided?
    Sometimes. But this is because of my feelings eating me alive.

    4. If you could do anything today to change, would you?
    If it would work, sure.

    I know all those things about mental disorders and CBT/DBT because I did a lot of my own research. I don't find many other people to be very helpful, and I felt as though I was on my own since day 1. I do believe I have taken an active role in figuring out what to do with myself, but that doesn't stop other people from criticizing me and telling me I haven't, while being completely unhelpful themselves and making me feel as though it's all futile anyway.
     
  14. doityourself

    doityourself Well-Known Member

    I hope you didnt take my post as that, because I understand what you mean about trying everything in your power or thats available to you. So please dont take offense to anything I say, dont mean any harm, okay...

    Actually your teaching me, I have wanted to know more about CB, to be able to talk about the process instead of reading about it online from some doctor that thinks he knows everything.

    So I guess we are waiting on a miracle for ourselves, something to come to mind that we havent tried before. Have you ever looked into post traumatic stress syndrome? I want to know more about that to, again by someone that understands it not by something theyve read in a book but by experience, and what helps them.

    Hope your feeling better today.
     
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