Mosque to Be Built Near Ground Zero

Discussion in 'Soap Box' started by Zurkhardo, Jun 13, 2010.

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  1. Zurkhardo

    Zurkhardo Well-Known Member

    An Islamic mosque and community center, known as the Cordoba House, is to be built in close proximity to the epicenter of the 9/11 attacks. Needless to say, this has provoked considerable anger and protest.

    There are many other articles and news reports on YouTube as well. The Mosque was given overwhelming approval by a Manhattan land commission to be built, amidst much outcry (which continues to this day). Opponents plan to stop construction by declaring the building that is to be replaced as a historical landmark.

    In my personal opinion, the mosque should be constructed. However misguided this initiative may be, I believe the intentions - which are to bridge a gap between Muslims and the rest of America - are good. Most importantly, however, I side with the 1st Amendment, which bears no exception to the expression of any faith, speech, or idea, however contentious.

    I would greatly appreciate other people's input.
  2. nagisa

    nagisa Chat & Forum Buddy Staff Alumni

    I definitely think it should be built. I don't see any reason why not, besides a lot of American's unease with most anything regarding Islam, and imo they need to get over that since so much of it is based on ignorance. Muslims were killed in the 9/11 attack too, not just Christians, and I really doubt people would be complaining so much about it if a church were being built instead of a mosque.
  3. Tobes

    Tobes Well-Known Member

    This can either heal the wound or deepen the cut. Americans (and by extension the rest of the world) can change their view of Islam, or they can criticize and hate and scream that it shouldn't be there.

    I am hoping for the former of the two, because I do not believe that Islam is a violent or damaging religion, and I think it's teachings can help people be better and act better, just by being in the public eye, positively, instead of having terrorists as their poster children. I think that a lot of people don't realize that Islam is a peaceful religion, and its the terrorists who have it wrong.

    Although I am for this idea, I think it is too soon after 9/11 to do it. People's feelings are still strong, and this will probably spark the emotions people felt that day. Maybe there won't ever be a right time for it, and putting up this mosque now will help to mend the relationship America has with Islam, if only by a small amount. But I think the most likely scenario will be that people will complain, say it doesn't belong there, and be generally angry over it. I hope that doesn't happen.
  4. shades

    shades Staff Alumni

    I won't go into a long explanation, much to the delight I am sure, of many on this forum. BUT, there are many reasons, both legal and otherwise which must (or should) be taken into consideration and...

    The mosque should be allowed!
  5. Mikeintx

    Mikeintx Well-Known Member

    I dont see a problem with it.
  6. Issaccs

    Issaccs Well-Known Member

    Unfortunately that is the only kind of religion.
  7. thedeafmusician

    thedeafmusician Staff Alumni

    Uhm... with all due respect, it happened almost nine years ago. When it happened, I was still a kid. Now, I'm an adult. I think that that's plenty of time that's gone past. And yes, the mosque should be built. It's about time that we stopped dwelling over the past, that we learned from it, and should be focussing on what's happening now, and what's going to happen in the future.

    Religion by itself isn't a bad thing. It's just how literally you wish to interpret it's teachings that becomes a slight problem, later.

  8. alices_ponder

    alices_ponder Well-Known Member

    I believe that yes it should be built :)
    why not like!? It may help to bridge the gap between the 2 communities :) xx
  9. empty101

    empty101 Well-Known Member

    Eh... I don't think that's a fair perspective at all. I've had many Muslim friends but it'd be foolish not to understand that the religion is consistently being used to convince people to suicide against American civilians.

    I'd like to say I support the building of the mosque but really I would never make a judgment unless I knew the people that would be running the mosque and the culture it promotes. As I would for any religious facility regardless of what main religion they claim to be part of.

    Islam is a religion that has maintained it's power over a large part of the world and held it back. You can talk about how Islam benefits many people but in reality without Islam's power the middle-east wouldn't be so far behind the rest of the world today. The declining power of religion over the last 400 years in the West has only benefited us and it would be great if other parts of the world caught on to this.

    I'm not against the Mosque being built any more than I am any other religious center but there's no need to glorify and sympathize with a religion and power base that doesn't necessarily deserve it. Then again this would really depend on the particular people running the Mosque.
  10. Theseus

    Theseus Well-Known Member

    I'm not American, but I don't think it should be built. Muslims have a history of building mosques over other faiths' places of worship after they'd demolished them.
    Also, Cordoba was the capital of Spain back when it was under Muslim control, i.e. a symbol of Islamic power in the Western world.
    It is very obvious what this would be a symbol for.
    They should be politely asked to build the mosque elsewhere.
  11. bluegrey

    bluegrey Antiquities Friend

    I used to climb a tree in order to see the Twin Towers from my back yard as a boy and I knew two people, one a schoolmate and the other a family friend and fireman who were killed September 11th. For over a week after the attack, my hometown was filled with a burning plastic smell and smoke.

    People living in all five boroughs of New York city and the immediate surrounding area live with the chronic anxiety of knowing Manhattan has one giant bullseye on it. The recent attempted attack on Times Square just reinforced this anxiety and with a recent walk through lower Manhattan I saw men walking around with combat fatigues and automatic rifles.

    The proposed building is going to be a fifteen story 100 million dollar Islamic cultural center- not just a mosque in very close proximity to the still ravaged site of thousands of tragic deaths. I have read that the proposed date of the opening of the Islamic cultural center is to be on the exact tenth anniversary of the September 11th attack.

    I really am not sure what to think or who to believe with regard the true intentions of this project but the bottom line is it is simply insensitive to the still fresh wounds of New York city area residents.
  12. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Well-Known Member

    The real question is this: If it was the Westboro Baptist Church that did 9/11 would anyone complain about a mega-church being opened there?
  13. pit

    pit Well-Known Member

    Talk about bad taste. <mod edit: *sparkle* insulting>

    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 14, 2010
  14. Zurkhardo

    Zurkhardo Well-Known Member

    If one reads about the organization behind it, known as the Cordoba Initiative, their entire foundation is based upon promoting tolerance, positive aspects of Islam, and mending relations. Ostensibly, the name Cordoba was only chosen in reference to the area in Spain that was once in close proximity to the West while under Muslim rule (not to mention it was viewed by both Muslims and Christians as a medieval wonder).

    I can certainly understand why this would be considered distasteful, especially for those more closely affected by the 9/11 attacks. However, as Lovecraft noted, we would never draw such visceral parallels between a religion's house of worship and it's evil elements if it were a Christian denomination. NYC as a whole is an extremely diverse and plural society, so there is a precedent for something like this be undertaken.
  15. empty101

    empty101 Well-Known Member

    If I lived in New York... yea actually I would definitely be complaining.

    Would others? Hmmm I don't know.
  16. Gina

    Gina Member

    :patriot:I'm in the US, but not in NYC. I was in both World Trade Centers some years before, so they were not just buildings on the news to me. I know 9/11 had a big effect on the US, for two reasons, it was not that long ago and we all had the fear of not knowing what was going on and the also will never forget the images on tv of the planes and the absolute horror of when the buildings fell, and the other thing is that it was an attack on US soil which is a very uncommon US experience. I do believe although the people of the US have strong feelings about that day, they may not be as strong as those who then and continue now to live in NYC. They felt it, smelled it, and had the daily contact with those who died there. They felt and saw the heavy hearts and lasting shock of those events.
    I do believe it should be OK for the Mosque to be built (it's two blocks away), because it was radicals who caused the events of that day, it is not the beliefs of Islam that caused that, it was the way those people twisted Islam to cause it. We do need to let Islamic Americans know that they are welcome like any other religion and we know that they as a whole are equal law abiding people. This is something all Americans regardless of what their religion is should stand up for. This is a good belief to have, but I think the situation needs to be addressed carefully for this Mosque. There will always be people who will disagree, but I think a lot of those in NYC who are against the Mosque need to slowly take in the info. and realize it doesn't have to do with 9/11. It's hard. :patriot:
  17. plates

    plates Well-Known Member

    The thing with moves like this, is that it reeks of 'tolerance/peace!', rather than value, respect for life, and an acknowledgement of what 9/11 triggered for people in Iraq and Afghanistan who died or the people who died that day. It's an a attempt to mend relations, on one side, while going to war, incarcerating/torturing people etc, on the other.

    It just appears to be a public image thing, and not to do with healing wounds. That can't happen with erecting a mosque but with talking, time, and patience, and I doubt for the people who died, or their relatives in Iraq- seeing a mosque being built at that site, would give back their lives, or heal that pain.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 27, 2010
  18. Issaccs

    Issaccs Well-Known Member

    It does seem naive to think this would bring any healing.

    The concept of building it in and of itself has already incited a lot of anger from the populace so to think its going to help those people is ridiculous.
    And then even though lots of us already say "I think it would be good" we are generally those who wouldn't have cared any more or any less about Muslims were the idea never thought of.
  19. Zurkhardo

    Zurkhardo Well-Known Member

    Some opposition is be expected, and was probably not surprising to those behind this initiative. However, much of the local community seems, at worst, indifferent, and New Yorkers in general don't seem to be bothered by it, given that their multicultural city already hosts many mosques (among other non-Christian religious centers).

    I can understand how naive and misguided the whole endeavor is, but to see it as anything worse exaggerates the issue. It will actually be years before it is even built, as the plans for the structure haven't even been finalized yet. I think people should just give it a chance, since viscerally fighting it certainly hasn't been too productive these past several years.
  20. chjones21

    chjones21 Well-Known Member

    I think if Cordoba was really serious about interfaith then they wouldn't build a mosque they would build an interfaith building. One that had equal space for each of the main world religions --- the would have a mosque area, a Christian altar, a Buddhist shrine, a Jewish synagogue, a Hindu temple, a Sikh gurdwara all given equal prominence and equal space within the building.

    I think they should also on another wall list the names of all who were murdered in the twin tower attacks as a proper relic and monument. Every single person.

    On another side I think they should list and talk about ALL the main faiths, what they have in common and what they propound.

    And on the last wall I think they should also list all the misery and murder that has been caused by religion (or if they want to put it that way, the misapplication of religion). They should talk about the role of Christianity in the crusades and the Inquistion and slavery, the harm done by missionaries in South America and sub-saharan Africa. They should talk about the invasion of India by the Moghuls. They should talk about gender discrimination in religions. They should talk about jihad. They should talk about Osama bin Laden and his motivations and the current terrrorism. I don't know enough about Buddhist or Hindu or Sikh history. I think they should talk about the caste system and the misery that created and all the other potential things.

    If they were really serious about promoting tolerance and understanding then I think they would do that.

    However, I doubt they are and I doubt they will in which case they shouldn't be allowed to build it, it is just disrespectful and as for the Westboro Church - if they had blown up my town and as a 'reparation' built a huge Westboro Church over the remains expressing why they are so fantastic, I think I would vomit.
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