My lies, my addiction, my apology.

Discussion in 'Help Me! I Need to Talk to Someone.' started by Menchi, Sep 28, 2009.

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  1. Menchi

    Menchi Well-Known Member

    I really don't know where to post this, or what to say, so i'm sorry where this makes no sense.

    First, i have to say that i lied to everyone. Or, at least did not tell the whole truth. Right now i feel like i am betraying everyone each time i speak, so i want to try and rectify this.

    Firstly... i lied when i made the vow not to commit suicide... I thought that if i spoke strongly enough, that if i tried hard enough to force myself to be that strong, that it would work, but... it didn't, not truly. I've been stronger than i had been because of it, but... i don't know how much of that was me. I'll explain as i go.

    And secondly, i lied when i said i was leaving... self harm was not the only reason i took the time out. I realised that i was being selfish in who i was, and how i was dealing with things, and that... well that i was using others, i guess, as an alternative to being able to deal with these feelings myself.

    When i pledged not to commit suicide... well, it was the right thing to do, but... i guess i used others as a tool to stop me. It wasn't my own strength, but knowing that i had made that vow, and others had seen it, that it was not only betraying myself, but betraying others if i did so.

    I didn't have words for it though, how to explain quite how my mind worked with this, until yesterday... but when i realised what i was doing, i... well i reacted badly, hence my diary entry for yesterday.

    I just want to explain myself now, i guess. I think i'm addicted to... well, i'm not sure quite what it is. Love or affection or something... I didn't think of it in those terms until yesterday, but the feelings i get seem to match with addiction. Feeling a need, instead of just a want, for such things, the bad reaction when i don't get my "fix" as it were. Its hard to explain, its not attention as such, but i guess it could come across as attention seeking. But its more... emotional connection and validation or something, i'm really not sure... i really don't know how to describe it, but seeing it as an addiction makes it easier to see how i react. The one thing i will say is that i never lied to try and get this feeling, and i've never tried to talk to people simply for this reason. But... its really hard for me to say how much this might have coloured how i am with people.

    When i wrote the post that i was leaving for a time, it was after i recognised that... well that i was being selfish, that i was seeking whatever that feeling is, and using it as a crutch to stop me from being suicidal, seeking to use that to blank out those feelings... which is wrong, so... i decided i had to distance myself from people, withdrawal as it were, to stop that reliance... and i used self harm then as a control mechanism, as an alternative to it, so i could try to at least not be suicidal in that time. Trying to overwrite the emotional rush i got from those feelings, with the physical rush i get from self harming.

    It didn't work as well as i would have liked, and... well last night i ended up trying to suffocate myself.

    Which is why i am posting in crisis, though i wasn't sure where this would fit. I came back now because honestly, more than anything, i want to stay alive.
    But i can't in good conscience keep stimulating the addiction as a way of stopping this, and self harm, while dulling things, failed me too.

    So any choice i make is a bad one, but... i don't want anything of me to be based on lies. So far i've managed to avoid that mostly. But now i'm at a point where no action i take can be a healthy one. The best i can come up with is to try and detach myself completely from my emotions, dull everything as much as i can, to stop the addiction, and then self harm where i need that control over my suicidal feelings. I guess i'm just not sure if this is the best thing for me to do.

    And finally, i want to say i'm sorry, to everyone, for being like this. I'm sorry if anyone feels betrayed, or feels that i am a bad person.
  2. Tam

    Tam Well-Known Member

    Hello Menchi I am so glad you're here and talking. Want to write quite a bit in response to what you've said, so will post this quickly just to say - glad you're ok!

  3. Tam

    Tam Well-Known Member


    Please forgive if what I'm saying sounds patronizing or know-it-all, I can only tell you things via the prism of my own internal experience - maybe that reflects what you mean, maybe not. But I hope it helps all the same.

    Addiction - equals need. Only addiction has a negative connotation. The feelings you are talking about trying to get in order to outweigh the suicidal feelings are fundamental human needs - to be validated (as you say), respected, recognized, accepted, seen as good, as valuable, as having intrinsic worth, as impacting on others in a positive way ... the list goes on...

    It's not a lie it's not dishonest and it's most definitely not selfish!!! (though I have problems myself on that score boy do I what.) In 'real world' terms the notion of using others is rife - as if there's something wrong with wanting to get good feelings, have basic emotional wants and needs satisfied by getting from others, by doing, saying, even being in order to 'get'. But if you think about it that's what's at the bottom of every relationship, every interaction, every connection with another person.

    It's probably the most honest thing of all - not a weakness, not something 'wrong' that needs to be changed or improved or subdued or hidden.

    You are talking about using it as a crutch to stop you from being suicidal and I just wondered if you'd ever thought that maybe the suicidal feelings ARE those other feelings unmet. That getting the good stuff from other people, connecting to them, isn't some kind of dodgy means to avoid suicidal feelings, but that the lack of it is what actually gives rise to the suicidal feelings. I don't know because I don't know your reasons for feeling suicidal, but I wanted to say that just in case.

    And at the end of the day, whatever means you use to stay alive have got to be good, even if you feel bad and guilty and self-hating for it - it's your own drive to health and happiness that's directing it - that's got to be something to respect?

    If you can put up with more of this type of stuff please PM me.

    Please take care!

  4. Menchi

    Menchi Well-Known Member

    I think thats where i disagree though, at least in terms of how i view relationships with people. I would never want to be close to someone, if the motivation was for my own gratification. If that were the case, why would anyone help anyone else? I've seen what its like for people to use others to their own ends, and i don't want to do that, even indirectly.

    I would say that a lot of my suicidal feelings do come from that... or at least, from the lack of that, for most of my life, but i use the word addiction, because i fear its become excessive... and the strength of my reaction when not feeling that is excessive too.
  5. Tam

    Tam Well-Known Member

    Ok, self-gratification - words that have unfortunately taken on a perjorative meaning. That's not quite what I meant. As a pretty innocuous example, I'm walking down the street and someone I don't know smiles at me. I feel good, happy, someone has recognized my existence, and recognized it in a way that means something positive to me - that's 'gratifiying', but does that make it selfish? And if I then go on and myself smile at strangers hoping they will smile back at me because I want more of that good feeling of being recognized, of existing in someone else's eyes - and happy day they do smile back, that's 'gratification' too - but am I using them? Yes, I suppose I am. But that's the whole basis of human interaction.

    The point being that it's a quid pro quo - by smiling at me that stranger is giving me something I want, by my smiling at strangers maybe I'm giving them something they want. By going all out to get my emotional needs and wants met - there's a good chance that in so doing I'm also meeting other people's needs and wants.

    I'm not sure I can explain myself any better. I just don't think that having that kind of need is bad or wrong, and I don't think it amounts to using people either. Those of us who have that need as something enormous and seemingly unassuagable (is there an us, maybe it's just me) probably seem like selfish, uncaring, manipulative, 'users' - and I can understand why you would instinctively back away from that.

    Sorry, I probably haven't really understood you at all. As I said, I could only see your position through my experience, and that's pretty limited I have to say.

    Nevertheless, I'm still glad you're back and posting, that means others will be replying with maybe more useful stuff.

    Hugs and kisses

  6. WildCherry

    WildCherry ADMIN

    You aren't a bad person. I'm glad you came back. You don't have to do this alone; it's okay to need other people. :hug: Hope you'll stick around and let us help you.
  7. Menchi

    Menchi Well-Known Member

    Well i do believe in the philosophy of enlightened self interest up to a point, but i don't think that is all there is to human interaction. And i've seen too much in my past of other people using each other for their own ends, their own gratification, for needs that could be in no way reciprocal, that i do have an instinctive reaction away from that, because i don't want to be like that.

    I guess thats part of what this is, after seeing that part of myself, that by saying it, getting it out there... well maybe i can get rid of that. The main reason for me calling it an addiction, is because of my reaction to it... or to whatever chemicals it is that are released into my head when i feel it, i'm really not sure, and because of how i react without it. I mean, i know everyone wants love, wants affection, but with myself, its to an unhealthy degree i think. I've... found this out most with my girlfriend the most, simply because she is naturally not an affectionate person (which is not her fault, there are reasons for that), which gets to me. Crying curled up in the corner of a room because she hadn't hugged me for a couple of weeks is not the sort of reaction from someone who has a healthy take on these feelings. I know i'm not explaining myself well, its hard to put into words what it feels like in my head.
  8. Menchi

    Menchi Well-Known Member

    Thanks WildCherry. I'm still not sure whether or not i can stay, recognising how i am with this, but i'll probably try for now.
  9. Tam

    Tam Well-Known Member

    Hi again Menchi,

    I relate very much to the situation you describe about crying curled up in a corner and thinking it's not a healthy reaction.

    For most of my life that's how I've been, automatically assuming that my emotional reactions to seemingly out of proportion things were something unhealthy, incorrect, excessive, that it was something wrong with me for feeling like that, for needing so much, for not being able to shrug it off like everyone else...

    I've spent most of my life trying to ignore it and get rid of it and that's what's landed me in the mess I'm in now. Truism, the more you push away or ignore or oppose a feeling, the stronger it gets - and if you do manage to squash it or override it, it just goes underground, lurking away in the background waiting to ambush you at any given moment of weakness or stress.

    Worse, often it appears in a different guise from the original overriden feeling so that just makes everything even more frightening and confusing. At least that's my experience.

    I'm now at the point where I've chosen to stop trying to get rid of those feelings, of that need, and am trying to accept them instead, making them less threatening and overwhelming and myself thereby less needy - paradoxically.

    Does any of that make sense?

  10. Menchi

    Menchi Well-Known Member

    It makes sense, yeah, and i would say its come about for me the same way kinda. I had to supress, ignore, and hide those emotions for 22 years, because my dad was an abusive bastard who enjoyed hurting people, and i didn't want to give him the satisfaction. Now i'm in a different country, i'm able to be freer with how i feel, but instead of the assumption i would have made (that the feelings would be dulled, through all that time having to do that, though one or two feelings are)... well i'm like this.

    The problem is that there are only two things i can do, try to ignore and supress the emotions again, try to fight them, to keep myself in check as well as i can, or accept them... but if i accept them, then the only way to resolve them is to either get that "fix" of affection, which is a selfish thing, actually actively seeking it, or accepting that i wont get that fix, and then experience the withdrawal reaction, of intensified negative feelings, self harm, and maybe even attempted suicide. None of those are healthy, so i'm not sure what else i can do.
  11. itmahanh

    itmahanh Senior Member & Antiquities Friend

    Hun above all else that is going on in your mind and heart please think about this.... be proud of yourself, you've made a real break through and you are really trying to hold on. Give yourself a much deserved pat on the back cuz "bad" people usually cant see their own shortcomings. Surprise that makes you one of the good people! Hope you are able to stay at SF for the support and friendship and move forward with what you have discovered. :arms:
  12. Menchi

    Menchi Well-Known Member

    Thank you... but i don't think i have anything to be proud of yet. Words are easy, its the actions that are hard, finding a solution, finding a way forward, and being able to stick with it. Thats the one thing i never seem capable of doing.

    I do want to stay... but i'm not going to do it for the wrong reasons. I don't want to stay here if the reasons are selfish.
  13. itmahanh

    itmahanh Senior Member & Antiquities Friend

    But letting yourself see the positive steps, as small as they may be, and telling yourself "well done" may be the first step you need to take. Letting yourself like yourself. Others can always seem to see the good and the efforts we make when we cant see them ourselves. You have done something to be proud of. You stepped up and told it like it is. Very few people are able to do that hun. And if you allow yourself to see you have done something good, something right, then the next steps will be a little easier. So I go back to the original statement, give yourself a much deserved pat on the back. I see the effort you are making and the want to move forward. Please see that too.
  14. Menchi

    Menchi Well-Known Member

    I... i guess thats one thing i'm simply not able to do. I'm sorry.
    I just find it pretty much impossible to be positive about myself. I honestly tried, but its still not something that is in me to do i guess.
  15. itmahanh

    itmahanh Senior Member & Antiquities Friend

    Well then can you settle for others seeing it? Cuz I do and just want to let you know :arms:
  16. Menchi

    Menchi Well-Known Member

    I've been thinking about this one a lot today, to try and come up with an answer... before, i would have probably just nodded along, and kept my thoughts about myself to myself... the best i can do for now i guess is accept that you can see it, rather than accept that its there.
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