Police Officers Murdered in the Line of Duty

Discussion in 'Soap Box' started by Twocky61, Dec 21, 2014.

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  1. Twocky61

    Twocky61 Banned Member

    Two US police officers have been murdered in a random murder just because they were police officers wearing police uniforms:


    This is very similar to the plot of the 1981 movie Fort Apache the Bronx


    Just like in the uk when police officers Nicola Hughes & Fiona Bone were murdered in response to a reported burglary


    As far as the murderers are concerned police officers are just that: police. The murderers just see these police officers as the uniform they wear; not people

    I am sure I am not the only one who believes in reinstating capital punishment in these cases

  2. Petal

    Petal SF dreamer Staff Alumni SF Supporter

    Just horrendous. I do not believe the murderer kept in mind these are people, someone's dad, someone's son. It was a senseless act of violence. I saw the facebook post he made on the news, I wonder how long that was up compared to when they were killed. As for the death penalty, I'm very on the fence with that, I just don't know, I don't think it is right to take away someone else's life but for cases like this one a lot of people would like to see the death sentence but do 2 wrongs make a right? As I said, I'm on the fence.
  3. Twocky61

    Twocky61 Banned Member

    The Bible's stance on this is an eye for an eye Petal. But as you say two wrongs do not make a right. By killing the perpetuators the judiciary are stooping to the perpetuators level. Anyway, the other issue in the case of the UK & Eire is this: Should the police be armed? Yes, we have Armed Response officers but they are as much use as a chocolate teapot when an unarmed police officer responds to an incident to be faced by a 'fruit cake' with a gun aimed at them. Many police officers are issued a Taser gun to stun the person if they resist, but a Taser is totally useless against a gun wielding criminal. Some Police officers themselves have stated arming police in general is a slippery slope, as arming police officers will lead to criminals arming themselves. A no win situation.
  4. Øyvind

    Øyvind Senior Member

    Oppressed people have a right to fight back. Especially in a country where police are are allowed to kill unarmed citizens, seen as superiour to normal people, worshipped like gods or Jedi knights, and where they have the death penalty for killing police officers, a human rights violation leading to the unconscionable deaths of hundreds of people who deserved compassion and rehabilitation.

    Now this incident might not fall under the "fighting back" category, but I can't really get myself worked up about it, as the truly most horrendous crimes are those committed by governments, government officials, or representatives of governments against their people, not the other way around. Crimes by those with power against those without power should be punished much, much harder than crimes against those with power by those without. "With great power comes great accountability" and all that jazz. I'd be less opposed to the American and Japanese death penalty if they were exclusively for crimes committed by the government.
  5. Petal

    Petal SF dreamer Staff Alumni SF Supporter

    We have an armed response unit here but it's only a few guards that are armed. I believe all police officers in this day and age should be armed. I think it is ridiculous they aren't armed. Most criminals will be armed if they're planning to do something serious, how are the police supposed to react back without being armed? Their lives would be at risk. I have always wanted to join the guards but not being armed and criminals armed scares me.
  6. Prinnctopher's Belt

    Prinnctopher's Belt Antiquities Friend SF Supporter

    I have to cosign Oyvind's sentiment here, especially that people in positions of power should be punished more harshly when they abuse or misuse that authority and it results in death. For example, the officer who shot Oscar Grant was sentenced to only two years for using violence where it wasn't necessary, and resulted in the death of an unarmed man who was face down on the ground.

    The police are in a position of public trust to "protect and serve," so when scores of unarmed people are killed and unjustly mistreated by them, and without much recompense, a sense of retribution from the public grows and unfortunately this happens.

    I don't support any cruel or unusual punishment.
  7. NYJmpMaster

    NYJmpMaster Have a question? Message Me Staff Member Forum Owner ADMIN

    No, I certainly do not in any way believe that a persons position of authority makes it more justifiable for capital punishment- in fact I would say the opposite based on inherent known risk associated with the job of police.

    So far as capital punishment in general - - no , and even if one somehow believes in capital punishment how is it possible that anybody can believe the systems in place now or ever in history were anything close to just and fair enough to be applied in a manner that ensured justice and had a 0 % margin of error. If talking about killing somebody in the name of justice it would need to have an absolute ZERO tolerance for error - and nothing any human has ever created in the world is perfect so that excludes that as a possibility. I do not even have to debate the moral issues which I believe should be self apparent to say since the possibility for error exists that capital punishment is wrong.
  8. DrownedFishOnFire

    DrownedFishOnFire Quieta non movere

    As a tax payer for the USA. I am not for capital punishment due to the costs.

    It costs so much more to excute someone versus housing them in prison for their lifetime
  9. Prinnctopher's Belt

    Prinnctopher's Belt Antiquities Friend SF Supporter

    +1 on this.
  10. Prinnctopher's Belt

    Prinnctopher's Belt Antiquities Friend SF Supporter

    Meanwhile, back in October:

    Ax attack on D.C. cop prompts warnings
  11. jxdama

    jxdama Staff Member Safety & Support

    One thing for sure, Obama wont say a peep about cops getting killed. if i were the cops and obama came to NYC id say protect your own rear end.
  12. jxdama

    jxdama Staff Member Safety & Support

    Oh, and diblasio was cheering the protestors of the police some of whom were chanting people needed to kill cops. diblasio is worse than dog vomit.
  13. jxdama

    jxdama Staff Member Safety & Support

    i am absolutely stunned that anyone could in any way find reasons to be on the fence or even against the cops in this case. as far as eric garner is concerned he had at least 31 negative interactions with the cops before and it was up to him to not break the law once again. he resisted arrest. he brought it on himself.
  14. jxdama

    jxdama Staff Member Safety & Support

    my blood is getting ready to boil. i feel awful that eric garner died for such a petty crime but what were the cops suppsed to do? eric garner repeatedly decided to break the law. our local talk show guy made a really good point. if you owned a business and a guy was outside on the sidewalk selling stolen or illegal goods you damn well would want the cops to arrest him.
  15. Sumerian

    Sumerian Active Member

    jxdama, you couldn't just have edited your first post, rather than making several additional ones? Having said that, I do agree with you.

    Cop killing apologists are part of the reason I vote conservative.
  16. Twocky61

    Twocky61 Banned Member

    Really? Here in the uk for example, it costs the taxpayer around £43k a year to keep one prisoner in prison; so multiply £43k by 90 thousand prisoners currently held in the uk prison estate & it cost the taxpayer £38,700,000 (I think I have that total right) per year
  17. Sumerian

    Sumerian Active Member

    Yeah, I don't get that either. It almost sounds like sarcasm, frankly. Basic logic says it's cheaper to just finish someone off rather than keeping them in prison for several years, but if numbers that prove otherwise are presented I'm willing to change my mind and learn something new.

    Also, I'd like to apologize to jxdama. It appears you can't edit your posts here for some reason. My bad, friend. [Edit: Although now I could? Ah well...]
  18. Twocky61

    Twocky61 Banned Member

    Maybe the reason capital punishment is more expensive than said prisoner serving a life sentence is because of all the appeals that are involved. In the US you see prisoners serving many years on 'Death Row' while appeal after appeal goes through until eventually execution takes place, if at all. Clive Stafford Smith is a well known British lawyer now practicing law in the US & his main remit is trying to get prisoners off of 'Death Row' into the general prison estate so as to serve a life sentence rather than be executed.

    But even having said all that I concur with Sefadu: How can capital punishment be more expensive than a life sentence?

    <edit guidelines>

  19. Prinnctopher's Belt

    Prinnctopher's Belt Antiquities Friend SF Supporter

    But this topic isn't about Eric Garner, and since you bring it up, do people deserve to be killed for committing petty crimes if they keep doing it over and over again?

    What are the poor police supposed to do? Well for one, with millions of dollars invested in their training, there were at least a dozen different ways the officers could have peaceably handled Eric Garner. Two, they're supposed to arrest without excessive use of force except for a fleeing felon. Three, after the suspect was already taken down and had his arm and hand out in open surrender, the officer not only continued to keep him in a chokehold - a method of restraint so potentially lethal that it has been banned by the NYPD for 20 years - but then put his knee on the suspect's head and chest, and disregarded his pleas that he couldn't breathe. He wasn't even armed. It was too long before they even bothered to get medical assistance for this man after he became nonresponsive. There were a dozen better ways officers are trained to handle the situation than wrestle and suffocate a heavyset man to death when he had his arm out pleading for help.

    Garner was easily about 350 pounds. What was plainclothes officer in shirt "99" who killed him, afraid this man was going to do that was so heinous? RUN away? Sell more singles? God forbid we have a most wanted cigarette hustler on the loose. Somebody call the cavalry. The guy could probably abscond as far as I could throw an elephant. It wasn't necessary to add pressure to his head and body to suffocate him.

    The fact you find police killing unarmed civilians to be more tolerable than civilians selling cigarettes in front of a business is particularly egregious.

    But as the system warns, always submit entirely, never say anything except to request an attorney when police approach you to make an arrest. Because they'll kill us, and we should fear them at all times. And if we challenge their authority, it's insta-death penalty for us, and the only thing the public will cry, even if the entire encounter was recorded on tape, is that you deserved to die. Because what are the police supposed to do with their training in handling suspects besides just kill you anyway? You had it coming.

    What tragic commentary each of these families has to hear.
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 22, 2014
  20. DrownedFishOnFire

    DrownedFishOnFire Quieta non movere

    The numbers are there. Just google how much states are paying per capital case versus life without parole cases.

    In California taxpayers pay 90,000 MORE PER YEAR for each death row prisoner.
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