Pro-life?

Discussion in 'Soap Box' started by Esmeralda, Dec 20, 2007.

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  1. Esmeralda

    Esmeralda Well-Known Member

    I know that this is a pro-life forum, so I must ask, are any of you pro-life across the board? Meaning, No abortion, no suicide and no euthanasia. I know I am, I was just wondering what the rest of you think.
     
  2. ybt

    ybt Guest

    Some are, some aren't. :mellow:
     
  3. *dilligaf*

    *dilligaf* Staff Alumni

    anti abortion, anti euthenasia, pro suicide when its mine :unsure:
     
  4. abandof

    abandof Well-Known Member

    I'm pro-choice for abortion and the same for euthanasia considering the circumstances. Pro life for suicide though, except my own ... as said before.
     
  5. worlds edge

    worlds edge Well-Known Member

    Not me, not at all. Simply because I'm posting on a forum that is pro-life, it does not mean that I see eye to eye with the administration on the issue. I simply modify what I say to agree to the Terms of Service, or failing that, say nothing at all. And I bite my tongue and move on quite often, FTR.

    I am pro-abortion rights, pro-death penalty, pro-euthenasia under VERY limited circumstances, and undecided, though provisionally opposed, to a pure pro-choice position on suicide.

    Also, doesn't a thread like this belong in the "Soap Box?" Seems like kind of a "heavy" topic for the "Coffee House."
     
  6. Abacus21

    Abacus21 Staff Alumni

    I have to agree with gmork... although I don't exhibit the same views as him.

    All we're doing when we sign up is saying we won't talk about pro-suicide / methods, etc, and will abide by the rules of the forum.
    I, though, am pro-life when it comes to suicide, and am pro-choice with euthanasia and abortion.
     
  7. ybt

    ybt Guest

    Incidentally, pro-choice, pro-euthanasia, pro-abortion (but this is always a tricky situation).
     
  8. Raven

    Raven Guest

    I am pro-choice for the most part, however I am very against late term abortions, their is no need for that unless the life of the mother is in danger.

    I am pro euthanasia, when a animal is to old and the we consider the continuation of life is more painful we have no problem putting it down, why are we so unwilling to do this to people that lives are ending and do not wish to live trough the pain?

    Suicide on the other hand is different from euthanasia in my mind from the following, the natural end of life is not immanent. This is a very gray area and not an easy one to answer yet for a person that was sure, that had no doubts I would not stand in their way, the problem is very, very few people are truly at that point. Those people I would offer a hand and tell them it’s not the way.

    ~Raven
     
  9. danni

    danni Chat Buddy

    i'm pro life for everything..
     
  10. Lead Savior

    Lead Savior Well-Known Member

    In the abortion department, I am pro-choice simply because I am "pro-women having more options."

    With regard to euthanasia and suicide/assisted suicide, I am also pro-choice. Don't think dying should be illegal.
     
  11. I am pro-choice and I am not pro-life, or better to say, I am not pro-existence about anything in this world.
     
  12. ~PinkElephants~

    ~PinkElephants~ Senior member

    I am pro choice on everything. it's up to a person to make their own choices in life.
     
  13. Darken

    Darken Well-Known Member

    prochoice on all. no one should have the power to dictate anothers life against there will. I will never be a slave and I make my own choices for my life, I'm no ones bitch. I suggest the same really, no telling when some one may try to control you for there own benefit or agenda. You should be able to do what you want with your own property, this includes your body, and no person or government should be able to violate your rights.
     
  14. Esmeralda

    Esmeralda Well-Known Member

    Then why doesn't an unborn baby have rights? When they abort a 6 week old "fetus", they inject saline into the uterus, burning it to death. They have video of these babies swimming/running from the solution and opening its mouth to scream in pain as it is burned alive.

    In late-term abortion, the 6-9 month old baby is delivered feet first, kicking and moving around, clenching and unclenching his/her little fists (keep in mind that at this point, the baby is viable outside the womb and pretty much fully developed). When the body is out but the head is still inside, the doctor takes a pair of scissors and jams them into the back of the baby's skull, at which point the infant jerks in shock and pain. The doctor spreads the scissors open and inserts a vacuum tube, sucking out the baby's brain. The baby goes still. The head collapses and they pull out the corpse, throwing it into a medical waste bag to be sent to a landfill.

    A fetus is a unique individual with irts own DNA and fingerprints. It has measurable brainwaves, a nervous system, the ability to feel pain and tiny hands and feet. This isn't religion, it's freaking science.

    The woman "Ms. Roe" who started the whole "Roe v. Wade" thing as well as her doctor now spend all of their free time campaigning to end abortion, comparing it to the holocaust in terms of murder.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 27, 2007
  15. Esmeralda

    Esmeralda Well-Known Member

    Some interviews with abortion clinic workers:

    "I was trained by a professional marketing director in how to sell abortions over the telephone. He took every one of our receptionists, nurses, and anyone else who would deal with people over the phone through an extensive training period. The object was, when the girl called, to hook the sale so that she wouldn't get an abortion somewhere else, or adopt out her baby, or change her mind. We were doing it for the money." - Nina Whitten, Chief Secretary at a Dallas Abortion Clinic under Dr. Curtis Boyd

    "They [the women] are never allowed to look at the ultrasound because we knew that if they so much as heard the heart beat, they wouldn't want to have an abortion." - Dr. Randall, former Abortionist


    "We tried to avoid the women seeing them [the fetuses] They always wanted to know the sex, but we lied and said it was too early to tell. It's better for the women to think of the fetus as an 'it.'" - Norma Eidelman, Abortion Clinic Worker

    "Sometimes we lied. A girl might ask what her baby was like at a certain point in the pregnancy: Was it a baby yet? Even as early as 12 weeks a baby is totally formed, he has fingerprints, turns his head, fans his toes, feels pain. But we would say 'It's not a baby yet. It's just tissue, like a clot.'" -Kathy Sparks


    "When I first started working there [at the clinic], I had to sit and listen to women answering the phone for at least a month before they would allow me to answer the phone. We had to know exactly what we were doing when we were talking to these women. We had to find out very quickly what their problem was, play on that and get them in the clinic for an abortion. We were very good salespeople." - Joy Davis


    "In fact many women will come to me considering abortion, and I have been personally told that I am to turn the monitor away from her view so that seeing her baby jump around on the screen does not influence her choice." - Shari Richards

    "When a girl called to make her appointment, we'd work her in as soon as possible. If she called on Tuesday, we'd have her in no later than Friday. We wanted to avoid a long waiting period where she'd have time to think about it. First she would fill out her forms, and then talk with a counselor...The counselors were trained in what areas to cover and which to avoid. They'd say, "I know this is a terrible situation you're in. What can we do to help make this better for you? Yeah, it doesn't sound like you're ready for a pregnancy right now." Their task was to keep the machinery moving—to get the woman into the procedure room as quickly as possible." - Anonymous Clinic Worker


    "If you can't sell abortions over the phone, you will not last." -Hellen Pendley, former owner-director of an abortion clinic


    Nice, huh?
     
  16. *dilligaf*

    *dilligaf* Staff Alumni

    :eek:hmy: :eek:hmy:
     
  17. resistance

    resistance Staff Alumni

    Ehh... very rarely do I reply to soap box threads as I am hardly ever in a mood to debate etc but them interviews shocked me! I am pro-life when it comes to abortion (except for certain circumstances) and it disturbs me to read that these people are just encouraging abortion and are not offering support or guidance at all. I haven't been pregnant so obviously I haven't been in this situation but many a time a person who is contemplating to have an abortion is going through inner turmoil and they should really consider it before deciding to go down this route, we all know that some women really regret having an abortion to the stage where they feel like ending their own life because they feel so guilty. It's a huge decision that should be thought out before going through with it. Sorry, but them interviews really frustrated me. :dry:

    Mini-rant over!
     
  18. worlds edge

    worlds edge Well-Known Member

    A six week old fetus is a all of a 1/2 inch long. It does not have a mouth, it has no pain receptors.

    And they're also less than 1.4% of the total in the USA, as part of the chart here showing all abortions. Those over 26 weeks (i.e. six months) being just a piece of the over 20 week figure.

    [​IMG]

    Must admit I'm not thrilled about them, but what you're discussing is very rare, at least in American terms. And it typically done for either grotesque deformities or to save the mother's life.

    I'll grant this, but given the other what appear to be deliberate distortions in your post, I'd like your source for this claim.

    Not at conception,and not for sometime afterwards. viz:

    Not at conception it doesn't. And not for quite a while afterwards. Most doctors seem to think pain isn't felt until the 18th week at the earliest, though, there's obviously some controversy about this, viz the varying opinions here.:

    http://www.religioustolerance.org/abo_pain2.htm

    I won't post it, b/c it is a long link and no part seems more relevant than any other.

    Not at conception and not for some time afterward. See above.

    I quite agree, so let's see your science, assuming you're going the life begins at conception route.

    Ms. Roe never had an abortion. She gave a daughter up for adoption. What exactly is her doctor campaigning about?

    This comparison is utter, absolute crap. Unless each woman who aborts is the moral equivalent of a Dr. Mengele?
     
  19. Esmeralda

    Esmeralda Well-Known Member

    Here is the science bit:

    1. Living things are highly organized.

    2. All living things have an ability to acquire materials and energy.

    3. All living things have an ability to respond to their environment.

    4. All living things have an ability to reproduce.

    5. All living things have an ability to adapt.

    According to this elementary definition of life, life begins at fertilization, when a sperm unites with an oocyte. From this moment, the being is highly organized, has the ability to acquire materials and energy, has the ability to respond to his or her environment, has the ability to adapt, and has the ability to reproduce (the cells divide, then divide again, etc., and barring pathology and pending reproductive maturity has the potential to reproduce other members of the species). Non-living things do not do these things. Even before the mother is aware that she is pregnant, a distinct, unique life has begun his or her existence inside her.

    Furthermore, that life is unquestionably human. A human being is a member of the species homo sapiens. Human beings are products of conception, which is when a human male sperm unites with a human female oocyte (egg). When humans procreate, they don’t make non-humans like slugs, monkeys, cactuses, bacteria, or any such thing. Emperically-verifiable proof is as close as your nearest abortion clinic: send a sample of an aborted fetus to a laboratory and have them test the DNA to see if its human or not. Genetically, a new human being comes into existence from the earliest moment of conception.


    Also, an 8-10 week old embryo will respond violently to a needle-stick, which indicates the ability to feel pain even at this stage. There are thousands of hours of video footage involving such experiments.
    By this age the neuro-anatomic structures are present. What is needed is (1) a sensory nerve to feel the pain and send a message to (2) the thalamus, a part of the base of the brain, and (3) motor nerves that send a message to that area. These are present at 8 weeks. The pain impulse goes to the thalamus. It sends a signal down the motor nerves to pull away from the hurt.

    By 9 weeks fingerprints are visible and the baby has started playing with its fingers and toes and starts somersaulting and swimming around in the womb.


    Does it really matter that instances of late-term abortions are so "rare"? What would you say if a baby was born deformed prematurely (at 7 months) and the mother paid a doctor to stab it in the back of the head and suck out its brains? What the hell is the difference? There isn't one.


    Of course, whether or not the fetus feels pain is not the primary issue, although it is an important one. The main issue is the taking of what is inarguably a human life.

    Norma Leah McCorvey (Jane Roe) actively campaigns for pro-life organizations. Also, it wasn't HER doctor specifically who is now staunchly pro-life, but the main physician who headed up the push to make abortion a federal right. And no, each woman who has an abortion is not akin to Dr. Mengele because she has only killed one person, but the abortion docors sure as hell are.
     
  20. Hae-Gi

    Hae-Gi Banned Member

    Obviously, I'm all for abortion. I think I've been quite clear on my views on this, before, in previous posts of mine. Fetuses are parasites and, as such, do not have rights. Those who have a wish to have deeper insight on how I feel on this are encouraged to search for my old posts; I do not like repeating myself; especially in this case, since it's an anti-issue. Furthermore, many abortion doctors are heroes that help victims of unwanted pregnancies, helping them rid themselves of the invading parasite. Thumbs up for them. Of course, the best is always if the unwanted parasite never appears in one's body, to begin with, as it is an invasion deserving of great dismay.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 28, 2007
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