Question For Religious People - Heaven/Hell

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fromthatshow

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#21
you dont disagree with the concept, i thought the thing that made us human was our ability to decide between being nice or being an arsehole, is it ethical to be bad? probably not, is it ethical to manipulate people into being good? definately not, does it allow for free choice....no. does it make us good......no (it makes us behave good but not BE good, there is a vast difference) it deprives the very thing that makes us human, for all the shit that entails i wouldnt change it!
Exactly. I've always said that it's intent and not action that matters. It is the intent to do good things and not the actual behavior that matters. What about the person with cruel intentions that does good things? Perhaps to manipulate people and such? Does this make him a better person than one with good intentions that went to shit?

And to whoever says that hell lasts forever, it cannot. God would never allow one of his children to be away from Him forever. God is merciful.
 
#24
I believe Heaven and Hell are symbolic representations of our states of mind and conscious potential; projections of our hopes for empowered transcendence, and fears of an uncontrollable downward spiral.

You can have good intentions (being grateful for Jesus' sacrifice, ruminating about how imperfect we are compared to him) but obscured understanding about what it means to have good intentions. You can't downplay the significance of attempting good works or separate them from good intentions, otherwise good intentions of becoming more "Christ-like" would be useless.

In some interpretations of Christianity, the most ethical, good intentioned human eg. Ghandi would go to hell if they didn't accept Jesus as their saviour. 0.o I take that to mean Christians project onto others how much they couldn't live without a belief in God.. he is their motivation for making the world a better place.. but they should also recognise that their way isn't the only way.

is it ethical to manipulate people into being good? definately not, does it allow for free choice....no. does it make us good......no (it makes us behave good but not BE good, there is a vast difference) it deprives the very thing that makes us human, for all the shit that entails i wouldnt change it!
Agreed. If someone was on their death bed and you tried to convert them at the last minute out of fear they'd go to hell, although your intentions are good, it is not optimising theological freedom. If that person had longer to live they might've researched more and changed their mind. "God gave people free will" so we could love him on our own accord. He could've saved the bible bashers plenty of trouble if he wanted us all to be Christian.. otherwise it seems we are here to make an informed decision. God's unconditional love either bestows sustained mercy upon the rebellion he initially allowed or he foresees those who will follow him and casts "hell" to the rest, making him not a very loving god after all... this is too black and white though, I incline towards believing in karma as a more commonsense cause-effect ethical system- that's not to say nobody can help "save" you from yourself, but ultimately the choice is still yours about how you choose to reap a wholesome outcome within the broadened parameters of religious freedom.
 
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