Sexism in Law and Order: SVU

Discussion in 'Soap Box' started by Patch, Jul 26, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Patch

    Patch Well-Known Member

    (Ooh, there is gonna be zero love for this post!)

    Alright, so I find that people who are threatened by feminists are the ones who are personaly offended by observations of sexism. Please think about what I'm saying instead of simply dissmissing it as a 'feminist rant' or whatever. K?

    Alright, so everywhere we look in the media, sexism is blantantly obvious. Television shows depict thin, pretty women married to (generaly; think sitcoms) fat, average-looking men. I can deal with that. What I'm starting to have a major problem with is SVU, which stands for 'Special Victims Unit'. In case you don't know, this series is about detectives and lawyers who work together to put away sex criminals (generaly).

    Random statistic: An estimated 91% of victims of rape are female, 9% are male and 99% of offenders are male. (Bureau of Justice Statistics 1999)

    Can we all agree that the above is relatively correct? Feel free to google your own statistics (and send me anything thats more up to date). But: majority of victims are female; minority of victims are male; majority of offenders are male.

    So how in God's name is it that SVU manages to blame 'The Woman' every freaking episode?? They've gotten quite creative about it over the years, but it generaly goes like this:

    Victim is female; offender is male: She asked for it (She taunted the man who killed her and we end up feeling sorry for the poor guy. I mean, she was a bitch.)

    Victim is female; offender is male: Story goes off onto something else entirely (One episode had a man sexualy abusing an elderly woman. That story ended about twenty minutes into the show, where we meet a women who has been killing the elderly. She gets the rest of the show.)

    Victim is female; offender is male: He has killed and/or raped countless women and he seems like a pretty bad guy...until we meet his mother. Its Mom's fault he's so messed up. (Poor guy.)

    Victim is female; offender is male: She blames the wrong man and completly ruins his life. (One episode had a sweet little 12 yr old girl who had been violently abused. I was like, man, How are they going to pin it on a woman? Ooooh, the sweet little girl ruined that guy's life. Gotcha. The episode ended, not on the little girl feeling safe, but on that poor fellow who lost his job and has to move because of her careless actions. Oh, and she was pushed into pointing the finger at him by a female psychologist.Yep.)

    Victim is female; offender is female: Do I need to explain this one? Really?

    And so it goes. Every episode has a woman killing another woman, messing up the case, being the cause of her own rape/murder and just being plain evil. This is a show about (mostly) RAPE and its the goddamn woman's fault!

    The writers seriouly need to stamp out the misogyny thats surrounds this show.
  2. Hae-Gi

    Hae-Gi Banned Member

    The people behind that shitty show should all be tortured to death. They even show it here in Sweden on several channels. Why? Well... I guess because humanity (in general) is putridly stupid and sickening. I hate the normal Law & Order, as well. :dry:

    EDIT: By the way, I'm not a feminist.
  3. Issaccs

    Issaccs Well-Known Member

    Could it possibly be the case that they do this shit to keep people interested in the show.
    You can only have a case about spousal abuse or date rape so many times before everyone goes "Same shit, different day, I'm going back to the channel XYZ"

    All crime shows do it, think all three CSI series, they're all glamorized and getting more and more contrived storylines too keep ratings up, its never the black guys in the ghetto who got shot over a drug deal, its the man in a fur suit getting run over on a highway or the female assassin using the internet to stage kills or the man in a nappy/diaper falling to his death.

    Its about ratings, the twists putting the women in bad light are supposed to keep the show interesting.
  4. Anime-Zodiac

    Anime-Zodiac Well-Known Member

    It's all about ratings for producers and creators of shows on T.V.
    If there pulling in high amounts of viewers and ratings then they will carry on doing it.
  5. Patch

    Patch Well-Known Member

    Ahahaha, is it that important for us to know?:biggrin: All 'being a feminist' means is that you believe women should share the same treatment as men.
  6. Patch

    Patch Well-Known Member

    I've considered that option. But honestly, its happened too many times. I get that they have to 'twist' it, so its not exactly what it appears to be (they always did this in the original Law and Order), but what about the episodes when the blame is subtle? When it turns out the mom made her son this way? Thats hardly a new idea. What about when the girl 'asked for it'? Again, not what you would call an interesting twist; all is does is generate sympathy for the killer (or remove sympathy for the victim).
  7. JohnADreams

    JohnADreams Well-Known Member

    They are probably doing that because they realise that human morality is beyond goodies and baddies. There isnt many genres around in modern times that have an audience that will tolerate purely good characters or purely evil ones. There always has to be an explanation for every major action. End result is the same though, the bad guys get sent to jail or are taken out.
  8. Smashed__

    Smashed__ Well-Known Member

    I think its interesting you see it that way. I actually had a bit of a giggle trying to think of an episode where I 'felt' bad or sorry for the perp or took the show that way. I watch Law & Order all the time and my favorite is SVU and then the original. I can't tell you how many repeats my family sits through and I don't think any of us feel that way (5 women).
  9. anonymousguy

    anonymousguy Member

    What do these statistics prove? That men are evil? These numbers should not suggest that women are morally superior than men. The reason these number are so lopsided is simply because it's possible for these numbers to be so lopsided. Men are larger and stronger on average. The mechanics of a man's orgasm lends itself to rape more effectively. What percentage of men are actually rapists? One out of 1000?

    When we hear about sexual predators on the news, they never sympathize with the man and look at why he did what he did. What SVU might be trying to do is add an element of humanity to the offender for once, and show that the offenders are just people too. They want to show that there is cause and effect. If a man hates women and commits horrendous crimes against women, it's only logical that the cause was women. The alternative would be to not sympathize with the predator at all, which would make the show more stale. The show would be less interesting, and they'd lose ratings.

    I think why you might perceive the show as misogynistic is simply because you choose to focus your attention on details which support your belief. The majority of shows portray men committing crimes against women. I think most here would agree with me that it's NEVER acceptable to commit these types of crimes, under any circumstance. As such, no matter whether they try to portray the male offender as a victim, the crime is horrible and he's certainly never portrayed positively for his actions.

    I'll end by saying that if every single episode portrays a woman as evil, then you are absolutely correct about it being sexist. I've watched the show a handful of times, and I never noticed it to be sexist. I am a man though, so I will not be as keen to pick up on these things. I may be more inclined to pick up on the fact that in sitcoms, the dad is often portrayed as lazy, stupid, immature, sex obsessed and other negative flaws.
  10. Bob26003

    Bob26003 Well-Known Member

    Sexism IMO does not mean treating Women the SAME as Men, because there are differences.

    For instance: If a Man beats his Wife. That SHOULD be frowned upon.

    The differences are there.

    What we are talking about is Respect and Dignity and Equality under the Law and so forth.

    There will always be cultural (and biological) differences as to a Man's and a Woman's role and so forth.

    Do we really want Women to be treated the SAME as Men and vice versa?

    Do we really expect them to behave the SAME?

    Variety is the spice of Life IMO.

    Does this make sense?

    I mean wouldn't it be kinda boring if there were only one Sex or one Race or one Species?

  11. Hae-Gi

    Hae-Gi Banned Member

    I was replying to what could be seen as a "feminist rant," so in order to not be confused for someone hating the show, only for being a feminist, I pointed out that I'm not a feminist. I couldn't give a fuck about what people think about me.

    I know what feminism means. Some girls/women don't WANT to be treated equally, at all times, however, so feminism is, quite frankly, stupid - or at least ignorant. Perfect examples are Master/slave relationships, but all females naturally must choose for themselves. You choose to become the slave in a Master/slave relationship.
  12. Patch

    Patch Well-Known Member

    So, because of what some women (according to you) believe, the entire idea of feminism is stupid/ignorant?

    I'll probably regret asking, but what the fuck are you going on about?
  13. Patch

    Patch Well-Known Member

    1. I never suggested that these numbers meant that women were 'moraly superior' to men. You are the one who put forth this idea. When I talk about women being treated like crap, why do people think I'm saying that the solution is to treat men like crap? Paranoia? Insecurity?

    2. The numbers are there to show that the majority of sex crimes are commited by men against women. And, once again, we ('we'= society, and you, personaly) have taken the blame off the offender, and put it on nature. Men are biologicaly built for rape. Yep. Moving on...

    3. "If a man hates women and commits horrendous crimes against women, it's only logical that the cause was women." Wow. Really, I don't even have words for this one. Wow.

    4. The show would be less interesting? The only reason I've stopped watching was because I was getting tired of the same stale ending. At the beggining of every episode I can guess whose fault it is. That gets old very quickly.

    5. Do you pick up on the fact that he always has a hot wife? No, not 'super model' hot, but slim and pretty. Guys with negative traits can be ugly and/or stupid, but women with negative traits had damn well better be pretty and slim.
  14. Hae-Gi

    Hae-Gi Banned Member

    Feminism advocates that all girls/women should be treated the same as men, yet all girls/women do not want this, thus it is ignorant/stupid.

    What the fuck am I going on about? If you don't know what Master/slave relationships (under true love) mean, feel free to research it.
  15. Susan_G

    Susan_G Well-Known Member

    IK hate that show. I also hate management at SF becaue they wont delete MY profile
  16. anonymousguy

    anonymousguy Member

    I was simply trying to clarify what I believe the statistics mean. I could easily look at the fact that 99% of rapists are male, and interpret that as meaning that men are of poorer moral fiber. The point I was trying to make is that a small percentage of both men and women for whatever reason, have the mindset that they'd like to terrorize and abuse other people. And that the reason this particular type of abuse is more prevalent in men is because their biology allows for it, where as a woman's does not. "When I talk about women being treated like crap, why do people think I'm saying that the solution is to treat men like crap?" What you're saying here never crossed my mind. From your posts I can tell that you're an intelligent person, and when you say men and women should be treated equally you mean it. And that means treating both sexes with respect.

    Allow me to elaborate, I'm not condoning, I'm trying to understand. It's inexcusable behavior, absolutely. However, trying to understand why someone commits this sort of crime may be helpful in prevention from it happening in the first place. It is logical. Maybe, I'm oversimplifying, but if a handful of women mistreat me during my childhood, in adulthood I might just be inclined to hate women. Regardless, under no circumstance is it ever acceptable to rape. I just try not to judge people no matter how bad their actions may be, and put myself in their shoes. I think we can both agree that there is something definitely wrong with the psyche of a man who sexually abuses someone. How can we hold them in such contempt if there's something "not right" in their heads?

    You've seen many more episodes of the show than I have, and you noticed a trend which made it predictable. Now they could easily have good and evil more contrasting, and no gray areas of speculation. Which would have made it just as predictable. Perhaps what they should have done was a little bit of both, sometimes the perpetrator is one dimensional and just downright evil, and other times it was his abusive mother which explains (not excuses) his actions.

    I agree that it's not right that every average schmo on these shows is paired up with a wife who's slim and pretty. It's unfair to set the bar so high for women, especially since women bear children. A lot of media portrays overly high standards for men as well, especially shows marketed towards young adults. Depicting chiseled muscular bodies as if that's normal. It's difficult on both sexes, and I don't like it one bit. I don't believe that SVU in particular is being sexist, I just think they're trying to create believable drama with multi-dimensional characters.

    I hope this response clarified my mindset a little bit, I'm sorry that my first post put you off so much. It was not my intention.
  17. pit

    pit Well-Known Member

    Charlie's Angels is much better than Law & Order. There's nothing like watching three hott babes chasin' after the bad guys in tight outfits.

    Law & Order is under the delusion that it's meaningful and enlightening. It's crap.
  18. Issaccs

    Issaccs Well-Known Member

    Don't say that, feminazi's will come and get you for being sexist and idolising women more attractive than them.
  19. Smashed__

    Smashed__ Well-Known Member

    this doesn't make sense to you?

    If someone does something bad to you, or tramitic as a child or whatever its pretty natural that it will fuck you up and affect your actions in the future. This is not to say you become a killer, it could have a positive effect just as easy. Its about looking into the mind of the killers/rapists..etc. Theres usually a point(or several) in a persons life that change their outlook on humanity and help shape their lust/desires.
  20. hammockmonkey

    hammockmonkey Well-Known Member

    what about a misogynistic father raising his son not to respect women?
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.