Some questions...would really like answers

Acy

Mama Bear - TLC, Common Sense
Admin
SF Supporter
#1
Do you find that having friends/acquaintances to do things with helps you “ride out” a very low mood and maybe even distract you from suicidal ideas/feelings?

In the middle of your feeling suicidal, would an invitation to go do something with a friend (something you would usually enjoy) help you…Would you accept the invitation? (Why or why not?)

I think when we are depressed, we tend to think we won't have a good time, so we do less. In my own experience, I've found that doing things - even if I'm in a low spot - is helpful. How is it for others?
 

Sunspots

To Wish Impossible Things
Admin
SF Supporter
#2
For me it depends on how suicidal I'm feeling - am I just thinking about it or am I actually intending.

If I'm just at the point of thinking about it, even seriously thinking about it, certain friends can distract me. They can drag me out and I'll actually have an ok time. Sometimes that's enough, sometimes not.

If I have specific plans and a close timeframe then I'll just shut down. No amount of cajoling will get me out of the house and all I want to do is wallow in it.
 

Witty_Sarcasm

🦄🦜🧁🌈🌝💖
SF Supporter
#3
I don't like to get out much and do things when I'm feeling so low. I like to go on here and talk to people and talk to friends on Facebook and such. I feel like if I wasn't in the right frame of mind, I would be a killjoy and bring the mood down for others. I'm more of a homebody anyway. That's not to say I don't get out and enjoy myself sometimes, but I can only do that when I'm not struggling.
 

Acy

Mama Bear - TLC, Common Sense
Admin
SF Supporter
#4
Thank you @Lulabelle and @Witty_Sarcasm. This is very helpful to me.

I know how "I" am in my lows, but I'm struggling to understand a friend who is all over the place with her moods and behaviors. She is inconsistent and I don't know why. I'm trying to be patient.
 

Walker

Admin
SF Social Media
SF Author
SF Supporter
#5
Asking here / polling all of us and getting 500 answers isn't really going to help your friend, C. Because each of us are unique in our responses, you know? How does your friend feel about it? Have you asked them? And if they don't actually know the answer, which they might not, then I vote that you just keep asking them to go out and do things. If they say no then you understand that and realize the situation. If they say yes then you've gained a date for the day.
 

Acy

Mama Bear - TLC, Common Sense
Admin
SF Supporter
#6
Hi, @Walker - Read my diary - The Shy Diary - putting it out there."

My friend complained that she has a deficient support system. "If only I had more people around who understand so I could be distracted. If only I could stop thinking about things."

It's been 3 years of this. Way back, the various times that we DID get together, ALL she talked about was "I am suicidal, I am anxious, I don't know why, I need someone who can help me, drugs don't work for me - too many side effects. I stopped the ABC med - tapered off it because I don't want to be on drugs. [C's Note: Doctor didn't know she was doing this and was upset with her, and it took a couple of months to get her back to the same improved level she'd reached] She continues: "I went to the sleep clinic and I'm only getting 80% sleep [C's Note: that's in the normal range]. Ativan is working. Oh, no! Now I'm addicted to ativan. I'm going off ativan...tapering down. Now I'm having having 'serious withdrawal' from the 1 mg of ativan I took per day for a few months, omg, omg, omg! I can't live like this. No one can live without sleep. The partial hospitalization programs teach skills that aren't relevant to me [C's Note: they used communicating with "husband" and "children" as examples for interpersonal relationships - not friends and colleagues, so she didn't think it applied as she hasn't a husband or kids], so I didn't do the 'homework'. The partial hospitalization didn't help me and I've done it twice now. Nothing works. I've got treatment-resistant depression. My doctor doesn't know what to do with me. I've seen 5 or 6 psychiatrists and not one has asked me about how I "feel" emotionally. The crisis team won't admit me to the hospital. I have no appetite [C again: I had her over for dinner - she ate two large helpings of roast chicken with trimmings, and then half of the entire container of dessert]...."

Over the last 3 years she has seen 5 or 6 pdocs. She has seen OB/GYNs, had hormone therapy and vitamin supplements. She did a mindfulness course. She calls the big mental health hospital here and speaks with the pharmacists there about possible side effects of any med she is put on - and seems to get all the really bad ones. The "withdrawal from ativan" was bizarre. Yes, everyone is different, but by and large, a few months of 1 mg of ativan and proper tapering down off it is not going to send someone into a very serious withdrawal syndrome for months - there will be some withdrawal symptoms for a short time. At higher doses (10 mg a day) for a few months, it's likely to be much worse. She contacted the community mental health substance abuse rehab clinics and went in to see a counsellor there for a few weeks. The counsellor ended up calling her doctor. I didn't hear the end result of that.

One pdoc suggested that since meds weren't working, she stop taking them and he'd admit her to the best of the best mental health hospitals here where they could easily treat her depression with ECT since drugs had not helped. She told him about the insomnia - and the sleep study. He laughed (she said "laughed at me") - not sure if it was a chuckle of "Oh, oookaaay, but that's normal sleep" or if he actually laughed AT her. She got up and left immediately. Then a month later, with new pdoc, was asking to be admitted to the same best of best mental health hospital. Begging for relief from suicidal thoughts. new pdoc tried more anti-depressants and recently has finally agreed that she has "treatment-resistant depression." Discussion between doctor, friend and her insurance about getting in to the best of best hospital for some kind of program. Insurance agreed to pay. Friend said, "Ummmm....I'm not sure I want to go and do that one." And apparently she wants to see her pdoc so she (friend) and pdoc can choose the program. Insurance said, "No. You don't need to do that. We can refer you. Are you going or not?" Friend hesitated and tried to get her own way - insurance threatened to cut off her employee long-term income disability pay. Friend has crashed again.

Two weeks before that, she was suicidal every time I spoke with her, but her brother was in town and he and his wife were going to a theater festival three hours' drive away, and she joined them, but was able to drive herself, stay overnight in a different B & B than them, and saw 2 plays - one with them, one alone, and then she drove home on her own.

I asked about other people here on SF to get a general sense of whether having offers to go out and do things is enough to help distract people and give them some hope that life is not all bad. It was something that was really lacking in my life during my really bad moments in the past - it would have made a world of difference for me. I really do understand that everyone is different and has somewhat different needs. I just can quite figure out what her needs really are as NOTHING helps except if she is getting constant "Oh, poor you, how awful you must be feeling, oh let's talk about those side effects again...how hard on you...oh dear, you were so anxious. Only 6 hours of sleep? Omg, you poor thing! And suicidal thoughts? Wow, that's incredible!" And when I stopped offering those kinds of comments, she stopped saying yes if I asked her out. I have continued to check in and acknowledge that she must be feeling pretty rough, "but let's see if going for a coffee will get you out of the house and distracted for a bit?" "No. I'm too depressed. I'll stay home."

So, I was really truly wondering at what point offers to distract are actually helpful and at what point it's generally normal to expect a person to at least try to help themselves and maybe accept some of the company and distraction being offered. Yes, I'm being incredibly judgmental here. I think people really need to implement self-care - and part of self-care is learning to accept the small offers of distraction, because they get you out and doing things "in spite of" feeling like crap. In therapy, I was told over and over and over that not to do things was sealing me inside a bubble of self-perpetuated misery. That if I went out, I at least had a chance to have maybe a moment of fun/pleasure...and that's how you begin to build a happier frame of mind. And my problem was that absolutely no one was asking me to join them and I had no money to join clubs and do things to meet people. My friend "seems" to have all kinds of resources that she leans on - when she wants sympathy and attention, but not to try to be in an actual reciprocal friendship with.

I suspect I might be sounding angry...I'm not angry at anyone here. I'm angry that my friend is apparently stuck and that she asks for help and then gives the people who offer what limited help and support they can the "Fuck you!" finger. There will be a point where she crosses a line of no return with me. I almost feel she has already. I will eventually stop asking her to do things and eventually, I will not check in anymore. That is scary for me. I don't want her to hurt herself. I also don't want to be pulled in and pushed away again. I cannot offer and offer and offer and basically be told, "Thanks, but fuck you and your offer...you don't help, nothing helps." I'm human and this has become hurtful for me. I'm hoping someone who is in a similar spot to my friend can offer some insight that helps me understand. I think that the constant validation of her being sick/unwell/in need/in serious distress is actually not helpful for her. But that is what she seems to "want." So what is a person to do?

Now everyone knows the evil that lurks under my Mama Bear facade. lol
 
Last edited:

BraveFace

SF Supporter
#7
Now everyone knows the evil that lurks under my Mama Bear facade. lol
And thank goodness for that! ;)
Your friend sounds exhausting - for YOU. I am not suggesting you be 'evil'... but a bit of space may benefit you both, before you get to that point of no return.

Maybe she will back off from expecting sympathy and attention from you and give you the 'head space' to find a way to say friendship is a two-way street. Which it is.

I am so sorry if I sound blunt, maybe it's because I am tired from a naff day at work, but I have read your posts here and you have compassion. Lots of it.

If you feel it's dragging you down, then please take care of you first. It's not selfish :)
 

Acy

Mama Bear - TLC, Common Sense
Admin
SF Supporter
#8
@BraveFace - thank you for your kind and supportive reply!! I more or less vented here (above) and in my diary on SF. I have stepped back significantly from this person and come up with some "validating but pat" responses to self-pitying comments. (For example, she said, "The insurance company should never have told someone in my condition that they would terminate my payments" - so I said, "No, that was not nice of them." I didn't say they should or shouldn't have, and I didn't agree with her self-assessment of "someone in my condition" (whatever that means ;) ) - I merely said the insurance company's action was not nice.)

I do "check in" with this friend as I would hope a friend would me if I were feeling unstable. I try not to get sucked into agreeing that things for her are hopeless. And I'm prepared to walk away if she gets to be too much - at least for a while if I need to. :)
 

kat319

SF Supporter
#9
Do you find that having friends/acquaintances to do things with helps you “ride out” a very low mood and maybe even distract you from suicidal ideas/feelings?

In the middle of your feeling suicidal, would an invitation to go do something with a friend (something you would usually enjoy) help you…Would you accept the invitation? (Why or why not?)

I think when we are depressed, we tend to think we won't have a good time, so we do less. In my own experience, I've found that doing things - even if I'm in a low spot - is helpful. How is it for others?

Yes to all of this! Part of my self care is to socialize. For instance, my friends invited me to go out on last Saturday. They always invite me knowing there's a 90% chance I won't show. Well, this time I showed up. I even had a good time. It was hard to stay present and engaged in the conversation at times, but I managed to have a few laughs. It felt great.

I am making myself accept invitations because I know isolation is no good. It is also a good way for me to gauge how my recovery is going. I already asked a friend to help me make sure I'm not isolating and slipping away into the darkness.
 

Innocent Forever

🐒🥜🍌
Staff Alumni
SF Supporter
#10
I'm human and this has become hurtful for me. I'm hoping someone who is in a similar spot to my friend can offer some insight that helps me understand. I think that the constant validation of her being sick/unwell/in need/in serious distress is actually not helpful for her. But that is what she seems to "want." So what is a person to do?
I think you had a valid point in your diary. (although I read it over 2 weeks ago when I was last here so it could be I'm recalling incorrectly) You said that it it's that she needs the drama, she has to learn to handle that.
What are you to do? You sound like you know what to do and are doing the right things. Keeping your boundaries. Being responsive and present for her. Acknowledging and being compassionate without getting led down the route she wants to lead you down.
Until she is actually ready to stick with help there isn't anything you can do. (I actually had someone once tell me that she wasn't going to respond anymore to any of the questions I was asking her because by her responding I would feel as though I'd done my part, when in reality I'd done nothing about anything).
It hurts for you both. For you to see her in pain, and know her pain is real and see that she isn't doing anything about it. And for her, to be in pain, stuck there.

*sneakhug
 

Please Donate to Help Keep SF Running

Total amount
$70.00
Goal
$255.00
Top