Something I've overlooked?

[TestForEcho]

I have a question. Hopefully this post won't be locked...

"You want me to prove that I suffer in terms you can equate to pain or disease... When life has become futile, meaningless, unendurable, it must be allowed to end." I've been thinking about this for a while now. Because it has become futile. I've already set aside some homemade razors for it. I realize the line between self injury and suicide is pretty big but I have the will to do it. I just need a reason to live. Every reason others have extended to me (or lack there of) I've been able to shoot down with logic. In my opinion we are all worthless, especially me. I hate everyone, including me. And the more I learn the worse it gets. Your feeble toenail sized monkey brains are unable to fathom the true scope of the infinite universe that surrounds us. While I'm no different, I believe I have discovered the true elements behind the mechanics of God and science. Though I won't bore you with the details, which would be nothing more than misunderstood, meaningless dribble within the conscious part of your mind. Your all FAR too brainwashed to ever see... Hmm, perhaps I should resume my original intentions for writing this publication. Though I will mention that I'm not intelligent, only intensely observant despite my apparent emotional flaws.

Though I would at least be content with a mild sense of depression if it were in some way compensated by happiness. But while our pointless existence proves we mean nothing to any sort of human perceived deity, one person does matter to me. She's the only thinking human I've found. Unburdened by the moronic arrogance over the general populace. Regrettably though she is thousands of miles away and I have zero means of obtaining any form of transportation.

I've made my video (if you would like to see I could arrange to send it to you within 2 days time though it does contain disturbing imagery); written my letter; and made two razors. I just need some reason to continue this worthless existence within the layer of the physical. The only reason I have now is the notion that I have overlooked something.

 

[Viper]

hmmm.. it seems that you are in quite a dilemma testforecho. Perhaps I can help you. First off, I appreciate your quest for an answer. Many of us like to find answers with little or no success. Even those who find "success" do not find the correct answer and only think it is. You are looking for something that is correct, and at the same time you want to know that it is correct. I will do my best to not tell you anything that is considered correct to many but is not true in reality.

One of these truths is that you must find your own reason to live. I do not know you and I will not pretend to. This is mere circumstance. I don't know anything about your life, and therefore it is difficult for me to give any justification for any of your actions. I will, however, try to share what I've found.

I do not believe in god. I think that people like to be "comforted" by the thought of an almighty being and have accepted him with no disregard for scientific evidence to prove otherwise. This is something I could never understand. With this said, there are a few things that can go along with that. As you said, "we are all worthless." While this may be true in the inherent sense, worth is merely something that you give your life. You are not born with worth, or a purpose, or any other nonsense. This does not mean that you cannot give yourself these untangible things. I don't know if you mean the same thing, but there are many people who are brainwashed into religion. I am sorry that somebody who shares the same views as you is so far away. It is very difficult I can imagine, but maybe me and you (and many other people I know) don't have such different views after all. I am always interested and open minded in listening to what other people say about god and science so I strongly urge you to share with me. Pretty please with a cherry on top (even though it will turn to dribble). :wink:

 

[worlds edge]

I have a question. Hopefully this post won't be locked...

You're going to have to forgive me, but I don't see a question anywhere in what follows. Could you kindly rephrase your post so it is a bit clearer what it is you're asking? Thanks.

"You want me to prove that I suffer in terms you can equate to pain or disease... When life has become futile, meaningless, unendurable, it must be allowed to end." I've been thinking about this for a while now.

In all honesty I would never ask someone to prove this, I'd simply ask how they've reached this conclusion for themselves. I suspect you and I are on the same page or close to it in this area, but I'd appreciate it if you could explicitly state how you've reached such a conclusion. In fact, I'm currently trying to hash out my feelings in precisely this area. Without much success I should add.

Every reason others have extended to me (or lack there of) I've been able to shoot down with logic.

Interesting. If any of this has occurred in an on-line venue I'd personally be interested in reading your application of logic in this area. Could you please provide some links?

In my opinion we are all worthless, especially me. I hate everyone, including me. And the more I learn the worse it gets. Your feeble toenail sized monkey brains are unable to fathom the true scope of the infinite universe that surrounds us.

This seems like an reasonable conclusion based upon my observations as well. The problem I have with it is that is disregards a great deal of data that goes the other way. To say nothing of the fact that worth and worthlessness are, I suspect, largely matters of opinion.

I'm no different, I believe I have discovered the true elements behind the mechanics of God and science. Though I won't bore you with the details, which would be nothing more than misunderstood, meaningless dribble within the conscious part of your mind. Your all FAR too brainwashed to ever see...

Good that you won't bore us with details. I personally find such speculations of about as much use as solving a Sodoku puzzle. Diverting, but not really relevant to the real world. Doesn't mean I don't engage in such behavior, of course, simply that I doubt its usefulness.

Hmm, perhaps I should resume my original intentions for writing this publication. Though I will mention that I'm not intelligent, only intensely observant despite my apparent emotional flaws.

The fact that you're considering such a project as writing up your magnum opus would necessarily preclude any sort of immediate action, wouldn't it?

But while our pointless existence proves we mean nothing to any sort of human perceived deity,

So what? If we mean nothing to such a thing, it means nothing to us. In fact this is along the line of what Nietzsche mean when he said "God is dead," as I understand it. We find or fail to find our own meanings.

Heck, why not go one step further and go beyond a deity of indifference to one of outright malevolence? That's the system the Gnostics practiced, that this material world is a creation of evil, and that our souls had been "imprisoned" in our bodies by this evil genius.

I just need some reason to continue this worthless existence within the layer of the physical. The only reason I have now is the notion that I have overlooked something.

Is this the question? If so, I doubt I could come up with a reason or set of reasons for you, any more than you could come up with a reason or reasons for me. However, having said that, I think you should give considerable weight to the sense you have that you've overlooked something, and rigorously pursue it. Since you claim to know everything behind god and science this should be a piece of cake. And when you've decided whether or not you've overlooked something you can return here and state in detail your thoughts on the matter. I'd be interested in reading them, even if no one else will. Though doubtless I'd disagree with at least some of it.

Best,

Patrick

 

[TestForEcho]

hmmm.. it seems that you are in quite a dilemma testforecho. Perhaps I can help you. First off, I appreciate your quest for an answer. Many of us like to find answers with little or no success. Even those who find "success" do not find the correct answer and only think it is. You are looking for something that is correct, and at the same time you want to know that it is correct. I will do my best to not tell you anything that is considered correct to many but is not true in reality.

One of these truths is that you must find your own reason to live. I do not know you and I will not pretend to. This is mere circumstance. I don't know anything about your life, and therefore it is difficult for me to give any justification for any of your actions. I will, however, try to share what I've found.

I do not believe in god. I think that people like to be "comforted" by the thought of an almighty being and have accepted him with no disregard for scientific evidence to prove otherwise. This is something I could never understand. With this said, there are a few things that can go along with that. As you said, "we are all worthless." While this may be true in the inherent sense, worth is merely something that you give your life. You are not born with worth, or a purpose, or any other nonsense. This does not mean that you cannot give yourself these untangible things. I don't know if you mean the same thing, but there are many people who are brainwashed into religion. I am sorry that somebody who shares the same views as you is so far away. It is very difficult I can imagine, but maybe me and you (and many other people I know) don't have such different views after all. I am always interested and open minded in listening to what other people say about god and science so I strongly urge you to share with me. Pretty please with a cherry on top (even though it will turn to dribble). :wink:

I'll respond to you because it appears that the following contributer to the conversation is only here to speak to me in a condescending tone as so many others do.

I'll indulge you assuming your intent is knowledge and not simply to psychoanalyze me.

God... I don't think of God in a religions light. In fact if you trace back the major religions to their ancient, unaltered recordings, you'll find that most of their writings described astronomical events. I don't worship or pray to any sort of "holy father". I've seen too many little kids die and too many rich murders live to be 90 to think that in some way, there is any ultimate justice or compensation for our actions in life. I don't think of God as a being but that's not to say I think of God as something less. God is beyond all understanding. But if you were to personify my view of God then you could say that God is the universal fabric of all layer frequencies (electromagnetic spectrum and beyond) existing without time, at all points. Humans crave a balance system of right and wrong, those that have realized the truth, usually become murders on a mass scale. Though that's not to say that these are my intentions. There are those you can't find in any history book that would make Hitler's actions look like child's play. As I frequently state, simply because something is unplesent doesn't mean that it's untrue. God is not an emotional being. We (and I) are, unfortunately. Bound by a flesh exterior composed of mostly carbon and water. I know how we exist, I know how life forms (except the first person perspective of thought and will), I know how the mind and body connect and what happens when we die. I'm not the first. People have discovered these things as well, some hundreds of years before me. My research started with them.

But I have to say that who I am seems to shift erratically. Different triggering effects within my mind. Phrases and images seem to change who I am. I'd call it multiple personality but I retain all knowledge and will of each personality. I've narrowed it down to 5 main ones but there are many others. Right now I'm in the calm collective state where in I can think very quickly and observe things in a more logical light. I haven't been able to trace all the triggers but I have noticed two. The phrase "A psychopath feels the same empathy for his victims as we do in carving a thanksgiving turkey." (From a report on the mental state of Eric Harris) Even now, this brings on an almost homicidal desire as I see no distinction between animals and humans. The second trigger is image based. Images of outer space and mass galaxies create a suicidal personality. There are others that trigger suicidal tendencies but this is a main one. Though sometimes these images and phrases a shown to me in my head. By whom or what I've yet to ascertain. But while my genetic line is prone to insanity and murder I doubt that my isolation hasn't played some part in it. It's these shifting personalities that often cause confliction in my beliefs and confusion for others. I WILL NOT TAKE MEDICATION! Doctors are evil fucks who should be removed from the population! I always go back to the fact of anti-depressants (Eric Harris) and AZT (which has caused the deaths of millions). There are too many evils to count. Never trust doctors.

My final thought (as it's getting towards dinner) is about your comment on my "one person". She doesn't share all of my views. She thinks. I'm more of a uncaring, unfeeling hateful human being. She is the opposite. Which is why she's a good balance. To be honest she's the only one who has cared or expressed and real interest in my life and in my research. All the other ones before me turned on me forcing me to sever the connection to them. If the world and everyone in it were to burn to cinder, I would be content knowing that she had survived. She's the only one I care about in this life. Sadly, this is why I can't bourdon her with my suicidal intentions. If I've missed anything please correct me as I've written my response a little hastily.

 

[Stylez]

As I'm too ignorant and stupid to respond in a caring and interesting way may I just point out that the book Holographic Universe by Michael Talbot is a good book to read about God and everything in the universe being nothing more than frequencies and wave forms....it has some info on multiple personality disorder also though that wasnt the slightest point in your post.

 

[roze]

Every reason others have extended to me (or lack there of) I've been able to shoot down with logic.

Do you believe feelings are just a mere set of electrical impulses and hormones firing up?

I just need some reason to continue this worthless existence within the layer of the physical.

I cannot find any physical or material reason to live neither...

 

[TestForEcho]

Do you believe feelings are just a mere set of electrical impulses and hormones firing up?




I cannot find any physical or material reason to live neither...

Yes, but this isn't to say that I think the mind is housed within the body. My theory is that the mind connects to the body via a medium of electricity. The two are on different layers. Sort of like seeing different people and places via your television. Emotion, would be the picture quality. It changes your outlook on the world. I realize this metaphor isn't really a full explanation but I've never really been very good at conveying my thoughts. To answer your question yes, they are chemical controlled electrical signals, but they are not, in themselves, our mental state. I don't think we're simply a collection of electrical signals. Though if we were or I found evidence that would debunk my theory, then I would accept it, no matter how horrible the idea.


Why do we go on? Fear? Reluctance? A primitive self preservation program built into our mind? Perhaps an event is needed. A final snap to push one's self over the edge completely.

 

[TestForEcho]

It would appear that my request for a grand answer has gone, not surprisingly, unnoticed. With all possibilities considered I had observed this notion long before it came into focus. My writings viewed by a small minority of those who are caught up in their own moral disfunction and with that, care little about my own personal situation. I extend them the same courtesy. But those that actually have any real interest in helping me or in fact listen to my words, have yet to understand who and what I am and how I perceive this flawed world around me. A constant sickness washes over me even at the mere sight of my environment. While not aesthetically displeasing, the recent discoveries I've made portray the material realm in an ugly and stupid light.

You don't care. No one does. Not really anyway. So despite the fact that my posts will go unnoticed and misunderstood I will depart forever with one final thought extended to you all.

Nothing we do matters. We are not loved by sort of God. Any help or intended affection given to us is merely to satisfy that persons own small ego. Any physical love given is a simple fulfillment of carnal longing, satisfying only the most primitive and stupid of biological functions. People are dim, wishing nothing more than to be told what to do. Simple programs running their lines of brainwashed code, fucking one another and consuming only with the intent to over indulge their already bloated and disgusting exterior. I hate all you idiots. I hate myself. This layer is making my weak little body feel sick 24/7 and I can't take it anymore. To die: To shed ones physical form by severing the electrical connection between the layers and returning perception to the layer where in physical is the illusion and thought is the reality.

I JUST WANT SOMEONE TO FIX MY STUPID LITTLE MONKEY BRAIN! I can't turn anything off anymore. My head is filled with paranoid thoughts and conflicting feelings of hate and lust.

I believe I have enough information to correctly and accurately kill myself now. I'm gone.

 

[roze]

It's not a matter of don't caring as i see it. It might just be that people don't agree with you... I don't...

Your calculated way of looking at everything makes no sense according to what i have experienced so far in this life. I've felt things that i cannot explain by any words, and that i cannot fit as being just a physical reaction in my body. Things that have widely surpass any material, lust or physical attraction for that matter.

I could be here telling you not to loose hope, that there are plenty of things worth living for, but if you want me to be completly honest, i don't know how will you be able to find any happyness seeing things as you see them now. If you see feelings in such a cold hearted way, if you can't let yourself be loved, i seriously doubt that you'll ever find anything worth living.

How to change your way of thinking? It's no use argueing against your calculist thoughts. You either open your mind to other possibilities, or find some meds that do might do it for you, even though i'm against that, cause it's never a solution.

Despite our differences, i wish you the best of luck.

 

[worlds edge]

I wonder how he thought I was patronizing him? :mellow: I genuinely wanted to read where he'd "shot down with logic" all objections raised against suicide. And, hell, he was the one who claimed he knew everything about God and science, not me.

I believe I have enough information to correctly and accurately kill myself now. I'm gone.

Since I'm probably going to be going the suicide route myself at some point, I can't really criticize the act on those grounds. I just hope he's doing the right thing for the right reasons. And I have my doubts on that score.

 

[Esmeralda]

How can someone with such a horrible outlook believe that there is anything worth-while in the world at all? In my experience, you get out of life what you put into it (more or less).

Echo obviously needs a doctor but claims that they are "evil". Try Scientology.

Talk about the pot and the fucking kettle. I don't know how someone so condescending to everyone on this board (even those who are trying to genuinely help and understand his point of view) can turn around and talk about how terrible the world is, along with the people in it. Maybe he includes himself among the evils of the world?

Either way, Echo obviously just wants a forum to spew his opinions and condescention, without even a modicum of respect or understanding for others.

Echo, if you are still there, you are getting what you put out. If the world is made up of "frequencies", then thought would operate on a certain frequency as well, and whether or not those thoughts are positive and loving or negative hatred would seem to have an effect on those frequencies, right? Instead of complaining about everything you cannot control, try controlling your own thoughts and behaviors and changing them in a positive way.

 

[Viper]

i personally think there is some truth to that. Doctors can be evil. Everytime I give them a paycheck for doing nothing....shoulda been a doctor.