suicide presentation made me think

Discussion in 'Suicidal Thoughts and Feelings' started by GabrielConroy, Mar 26, 2009.

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  1. GabrielConroy

    GabrielConroy Well-Known Member

    I am a health advocate and among the many things we are supposed to be a "resource" for is help with suicide and depression. Not in the function of a therapist but in the function of someone to talk to and point in the direction of proffesional help.

    Anyways the presentation on suicide was today (actually yesterday now) and it really made me get a better view of a paticular kind of view about depression and people in general. In my eyes this view falls short of reality. The idea that the right combonation of meds+therapy+positive support is a scientific formula for curing depression and making someone happy seems naive and misses the most important factor of subjective human experience.

    It is a statistical inevitability that some people will have terrible miserable lives that never get better. It is not a necessary truth that there is a reason for every individual person to live.
  2. crookxshanks

    crookxshanks Well-Known Member

    believe me it takes a lot to even go and get help because of how people will judge you. sometimes it takes something to happen before the help will be given or even recognised. or even if people want to go and get help. its a vicious circle

    ive always believed that the thought of just being a statistic shouldnt come into it at all. thats just unfair because it isnt taking peoples feelings or experiences into account. the statistics could be lowered if people got the help they deserved

    but thats just my view
  3. shades

    shades Staff Alumni

    You have great insight and I'm not kidding about this-I'm going to quote this to my therapist; I cant wait to see her reaction.:laugh:
  4. GabrielConroy

    GabrielConroy Well-Known Member

    Im curious to see how she reacts. :laugh:
    Keep us updated
  5. the fleet asleep

    the fleet asleep Well-Known Member

    ha, im sure the irony wasnt lost on you jimbo.

    these people mean well, of course, much the same as anyone in the same field means well. i have to agree with you though, and say that, i too, think those kinds of expectations are somewhat less than realistic.

    i feel this way. i think that people who are severely suicidal will always see suicide as a means of coping. i dont think any amount of drugs and counseling will change that mindset. i dont think theres a time in my life when i wont think of suicide after something particularly bad has happened to me, though im not particularly bothered by this.

    in my opinion, its a matter of judgement. anyone with a clear head on their shoulders understands that suicide will not solve anything, and that it not solving anything is a best case scenario (not taking into account the pain it will cause to others). its all in how well you can recognize your irrationality when youre being irrational, rather than trying not to be irrational at all IMHO. this really isnt something youre going to treat with drugs. thankfully, it seems like the lions share of suicidal people are level headed enough not to kill themselves.

    anyway, im sure being i there was a headtrip. youre kinda like your double agent on the inside

    edit: 100th post for me, jimbo. ill meet you at your bench for a celebratory beer.
  6. GabrielConroy

    GabrielConroy Well-Known Member

    Working the inside game :wink:
    And dont worry me and my bench aren't going anywhere. Night three woohoo!
  7. shades

    shades Staff Alumni

    Jimmy: I may go to therapy today, so I will let you know what she says!:smile:
  8. shades

    shades Staff Alumni

    Jimmy: Went to my therapist today! Started by telling her of this logical and reasonable material. Right away, she wanted to know who said it, what their background was, what kind of schooling, degrees, etc...Then, of course, she disagreed (probably since she wants to keep her job and as many clients as possible). THen she said that I just used this as an excuse to miss some of my recent appointments (which, by the way is not true). She became totally defensive about it, which of course makes me suspect that she probably actually agrees with it but would be out of work if she said so. I mean, if a therapist told me that right off the bat, I probably wouldn't be very likely to go. They would have to make a very good case of continuing with it despite the reality of what you said. The final outcome was that I felt better after the session and didn't bring it up anymore, but I might bring it up again next time to try and get her to admit that some of this must be true.
  9. GabrielConroy

    GabrielConroy Well-Known Member

    Sounds like she isn't entirely sure how to respond. I'm not sure how many therapists have to actually deal with the fundamental ideas behind their profession. Not saying all therapists are bad just that in my experience some dont really know what theyre doing.

    btw as for my credentials tell her I'm a nobel prize winner in physics, literature and economics in addition to the peace prize.
    Nah im just a college student. :laugh:

    Suicidal people are always considered insane (in some sense) in our society but the above is one of the arguments that comes off as reasonable to me. Most people just cant reconcile the idea of a "rational suicide" because theyve thought all their lives those two things are fundamentally opposing.

    Not saying you should go kill yourself or anything but I feel like there are two sides to the issue when most people only see one.
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