Discussion in 'Soap Box' started by Live_life, Oct 3, 2010.

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  1. Live_life

    Live_life Member


    In the Qur'an, which was revealed fourteen centuries ago at a time when the science of astronomy was still primitive, the expansion of the universe was described in the following terms:

    And it is We Who have constructed the heaven with might, and verily, it is We Who are steadily expanding it. (Qur'an, 51:47)

    The word "heaven," as stated in the verse above, is used in various places in the Qur'an. It is referring to space and the wider universe. Here again, the word is used with this meaning, stating that the universe "expands." The Arabic word "moosiaaoona" in the term "inna lamoosiaaoona," translated into English as "it is We Who are steadily expanding it", comes from the verb "evsea," meaning "to expand." The prefix "la" emphasises the following name or title and adds a sense of "to a great extent." This expression therefore means "We expand the sky or the universe to a great extent." This is the very conclusion that science has reached today. 1

    Until the dawn of the 20th century, the only view prevailing in the world of science was that "the universe has a constant nature and it has existed since infinite time." However, modern research, observations, and calculations carried out by means of modern technology have revealed that the universe in fact had a beginning and that it constantly "expands."

    At the beginning of the 20th century, the Russian physicist Alexander Friedmann and the Belgian cosmologist Georges Lemaitre theoretically calculated that the universe is in constant motion and that it is expanding.

    From the moment of the Big Bang, the universe has been constantly expanding at a great speed. Scientists compare the expanding universe to the surface of a balloon that is inflated.

    This notion was confirmed by the use of observational data in 1929. While observing the sky with a telescope, Edwin Hubble, the American astronomer, discovered that the stars and galaxies were constantly moving away from each other. This discovery is regarded as one of the greatest in the history of astronomy. During these observations, Hubble established that the stars emit a light that turns redder according to their distance. That is because according to the known laws of physics, light heading towards a point of observation turns violet, and light moving away from that point assumes a more reddish hue. During his observations, Hubble noted a tendency towards the colour red in the light emitted by stars. In short, the stars were moving further and further away, all the time. The stars and galaxies were not only moving away from us, but also from each other. A universe where everything constantly moves away from everything else implied a constantly expanding universe. The observations carried out in the following years verified that the universe is constantly expanding.

    In order to gain a clearer understanding of this, let us imagine the universe to be the surface of a balloon being inflated. In the same way that the more the balloon is inflated, the further away the points on its surface move from one another, celestial bodies also move away from one another as the universe expands. This was theoretically discovered by Albert Einstein, regarded as one of the greatest scientists of the 20th century. However, in order to avoid violating the "static universe model" that was generally accepted at that time, Einstein laid that discovery aside. He would later describe this as the greatest blunder of his life. 2

    This fact was explained in the Qur'an in a time when telescopes and similar technological advancements were not even close to being invented. This is because the Qur'an is the Word of Allah: the Creator and Ruler of the entire universe.


    The Big Crunch theory proposes that the universe, that began expanding with the Big Bang, will collapse in on itself with increasing speed. According to the theory, this collapse of the universe will continue until the universe has lost all its mass and turned into a single point of infinite density.

    As we have stated above, the creation of the universe began with a huge explosion. From this point, the universe has been expanding ever since. Scientists say that when the mass of the universe has reached a sufficient level, this expansion will come to an end because of gravity, causing the universe to collapse in on itself. 3

    It is also believed that the contracting universe will end in a fierce heat and contraction known as the "Big Crunch." This would lead to the end of all forms of life as we know them. Renata Kallosh and Andrei Linde, professors of physics from Stanford University, made the following statements on the subject:

    The universe may be doomed to collapse and disappear. Everything we see now, and at a much larger distance that we cannot see, will collapse into a point smaller than a proton. Locally, it will be the same as if you were inside a black hole... We have found that some of the best attempts to describe dark energy predict that it will gradually become negative, which will cause the universe to become unstable, then collapse... Physicists have known that dark energy could become negative and the universe could collapse sometime in the very distant future... but now we see that we might be, not in the beginning, but in the middle of the life cycle of our universe. 4

    This is how this scientific hypothesis of the Big Crunch is indicated in the Qur'an:

    That Day We will fold up heaven like folding up the pages of a book. As We originated the first creation so We will regenerate it. It is a promise binding on Us. That is what We will do. (Qur'an, 21:104)

    In another verse, this state of the heavens is described thus:

    They do not measure Allah with His true measure. The whole earth will be a mere handful for Him on the Day of Rising the heavens folded up in His right hand. Glory be to Him! He is exalted above the partners they ascribe! (Qur'an, 39:67)

    According to the Big Crunch theory, the universe will begin to collapse slowly and will then increasingly pick up speed. At the end of the process the universe will have infinite density and be infinitely hot and small. This scientific theory runs parallel to the Qur'anic explanation of this particular scientific concept. (Allah knows best)


    1. S. Waqar Ahmed Husaini, The Quran for Astronomy and Earth Exploration from Space 3rd ed. (New Delhi: Goodword Press: 1999), 103-108.
    3. Philip Ball, "Black Crunch Jams Universal Cycle," Nature, 23 December 2002; Dr. David Whitehouse, "Universe is 'doomed to collapse'," BBC News Online, 22 October 2002,; and Mark Schwartz, "Cosmic 'big crunch' could trigger an early demise of our universe," Stanford Report, 25 September 2002.
    4. Schwartz, "Cosmic 'big crunch' could trigger an early demise of our universe,"

    Please read more here on the Miracles of the Qur'an:

    Please watch: [Holy] Quran : Top Scientists Comments on Scientific Miracles in the Quran * # Faith and Science #

    Read the Qur'an in English translation for your own knowledge:
  2. Aphorism

    Aphorism Well-Known Member

    Do you actually speak Arabic, and can you vouch for the accuracy in your cited verses?
  3. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Well-Known Member

    Copy/Pastas aren't that impressive, particularly ones with so many spelling and grammar errors.

    Although modern astronomy does put forth that the universe is still expanding It does not in anyway say it's because of 'We'. We came a few billion years after the whole expansion thing started ~15 billion years ago.

    Although the whole determinism movement was all the rage in the science world from the 17th century to the 20th it was *NOT* a scientific standard to believe that the universe was infinitely old. Either way the expansion of the universe does not disprove determinism per se, it's wholly irrelevant here. The Quran quote neither confirms nor denies determinism so why did you bring it up?

    Funny, I could almost swear Edwin Hubble, the man that figured out the whole expansion thing, died in 1953. Oh yes, he did. It's dishonest to say that it's modern technology and math that figured this out not only because it isn't true but because it was only said to try and sway people into thinking the Quran is a bloody textbook.

    Edwin Hubble used what is now old technology and knowledge: The human brain, the telescope and the Doppler effect. With those three things he figured out that all galaxies were moving away from each other, and therefore expansion was occurring in all directions. Simple.

    I'm unfamiliar with their works, but we've already covered the expanding book and to say the whole universe is in motion is a nonsensical proposition; one can only move in relation to other objects - what is the universe moving relative to? It's clear that whomever the author of this blurb may be, they are not even aware of grade 9 physics lessons.

    Oh, so you do know about Hubble. How great, now you're showing your own BS by referring to all the 'modern technology' and then talking about how it was really just a telescope in 1930.

    Ya, this is bullocks here. The concept of a static universe and a deterministic universe ARE NOT the same; the semantical difference being lost on the author makes clear the author's lack of any real education in physics.

    It's clear the universe isn't static - I can move my fingers to type this. (I guess one could posit that it's static in 4d, but that's more complex than this refutation needs to get.) The idea Einstein loved was determinism - that there was a mathematical formula to explain any and all phenomena. The expanding universe can be explained in a mathematical formula! Expanding universe does not conflict with determinism per se.

    I can think of only one thing that Einstein said he regretted he did, and that was the Manhattan project. Most people today consider his 'big blunder' to be rejecting the unpredictability inherent in the discovery of quantum mechanics, although Einstein himself never faltered from attempting to come up with a deterministic relation between gravity and electro-magnetism. Einstein died without accepting the concepts of quantum mechanics.

    So if I can find some ambiguous phrase in the Rg Vedas that sounds like it may corroborate scientific fact will you convert to Hinduism? The Rg Vedas is clear that the world was created, not extant for all time, so clearly the Rg Vedas knew about the Big Bang, right?

    Again the author exposes ignorance of physics - the singularity that the Big Crunch claims will occur would have A LOT of mass, not none. In fact the singularity would have all the mass in the universe.

    FALSE. An explosion and expansion are not interchangeable. Again, the author shows ignorance of modern physics.

    Eh, no. The 'point' where the Big Bang happened is everywhere. Before the Big Bang there was no space-time to speak of, so you can't say 'the Big Bang happened here', it happened everywhere. That's what makes the Big Bang an expansion, not an explosion.

    Massive ignorance again. The mass of the universe is, to the best of modern science's knowledge, constant... while, the level of mass and energy is constant with an exchange rate of E=mc^2. If the Big Crunch happens it will be because gravity slows and then reverses the expansion, not due to magical increases in mass.

    Also another key thing to remember: The Big Crunch idea is NOT scientific fact, there is insufficient information to make anything but guesses as to whether gravity will be able to stop the expansion.

    It's believed by some, not all. As I said, no proof either way on the end of the universe.

    Meh, fair enough to say that.

    Man, won't you feel stupid if it turns out that the Big Crunch idea gets tossed aside in favour of the 'eternal expansion' possibility!

    Oh yes, the Quran surely is speaking of the Big Crunch idea here, what with their explicit references and lack of ambiguity and mystical speech!

    And then what? Allah puts the singularity in his tote bag and takes us home to put us on the trophy shelf?
  4. 1izombie

    1izombie Well-Known Member

    lolz that was some funny stuff
  5. shades

    shades Staff Alumni

    I thought the "Big Crunch" was the new candy bar...a larger, thicker version of a Nestle's Crunch bar!

    But seriously Live Life...what is your point?
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