Trying to understand the seduction of suicide...

Discussion in 'Suicidal Thoughts and Feelings' started by dragonfly70, Sep 5, 2012.

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  1. dragonfly70

    dragonfly70 Well-Known Member

    Why does it call to us, drawing us in like ancient sirens? I have so much to live for, people who love and need me, and yet I find myself drawn to the thoughts, the music, the finality of ending my life. I'm not in any imminent danger. They're just thoughts, and oddly distant ones at that, but they're there.

    I can "see" a woman in my mind - she is standing in front of her lethal means, just contemplating. I sit back and watch, more curious than anything else, just to see what she chooses to do. It is me, yet not me at the same time. I do not feel compelled to rescue her, nor do I feel compelled to join her. It's a very odd sensation and one that has been hanging around with me for days.

    I told my pdoc about it yesterday, and we have increased my medication, so we'll see if that helps any. My mother died last month, my father went into ICU and my already tenuous relationship with my sisters fell apart. I began to crash into a depression, but much of that has lifted now. But part of me is reluctant to let this go - these thoughts, these feelings, this woman in my mind.

    I just don't understand it all.
  2. I think part of it, at least for some of us, is a deeper desire to gain some semblance of control; to be the master of one's own fate, as it were. If that makes sense.

    I read an interesting self help article one time, I wish I could track it down, that made an interesting point. It was saying how suicidal feelings don't always necessarily mean a desire to die; however, is the end result of exhausting all coping mechanisms. It went on to say there are two ways to fight it: first, getting rid of the trigger, second, giving yourself more comping mechanisms.

    I think it's a little different for everyone, though.
  3. dragonfly70

    dragonfly70 Well-Known Member

    I think that does make sense. Things have felt out of control all summer, even before my mother's death.

    Unfortunately, getting rid of the triggers isn't really possible, though I have distanced myself from my sisters and fully accepted the futility of putting any more energy into those relationships, but I am saddened by it all. As for coping mechanisms, I think I'm compartmentalizing the effects of the sheer emotional exhaustion this summer has left me with and although I am having suicidal feelings, I have internally put them at a safe distance. It has felt somewhat like I felt last winter and that time ultimately led to a severe, profound depression and a hospitalization in March. I have bipolar disorder, so I am no stranger to severe depression, but this one really knocked me on my ass - I got to the point where I literally could not feed myself. Not that I wasn't hungry, but I was so fatigued that I couldn't lift a fork. I think it's the closest I've been to a catatonic depression. I don't want to get to that point again, so we're addressing it now. Unfortunately, the older I get, the less mania I'm experiencing - not that I'm advocating for a full-blown manic episode as those can be equally as destructive, but a nice manageable hypomania now and then would help me feel more balanced, I think. (What can I say...there really are some positive benefits to bipolar disorder...but that is for another post.)

    Aside from the compartmentalization, I'm trying to be mindful of what I need to nurture myself right now. Making sure I'm getting my sleep and trying to eat regularly. Also, making time for myself - not so much putting my family's needs second, but making sure my needs are a little higher on the list than they typically are (I think it's a mom thing, the self-imposed self-sacrifice). But some days I'm just soul-weary and life becomes tiresome.
  4. Forgotten_Man

    Forgotten_Man Well-Known Member

    My understanding with this topic is that I hate myself so much that I want to cease to be. That is why I am so incredibly seduced by suicide.
  5. dragonfly70

    dragonfly70 Well-Known Member

    First, let me say thank you for replying - it helps me to understand some of this.

    Next, I also want to say that you are NOT "human trash". I've read some of your posts and I think it's unconscionable that nobody called to check in with you after the movie theater massacre. You don't suck, your "friends" do. I don't understand why you don't want to seek help, but I respect and applaud your ability to at least be honest about that. I'm not going to tell you to think of the pain of others or that you are needed here - which you are, btw... but what I will say is that you should stay alive just to spite the people who have kept you down. Show them that you're better than they give you credit for, because I think you are.
  6. justMe7

    justMe7 Well-Known Member

    Sometimes it's a concrete release from everything we accept and touch with in our lives. We aren't exactly supposed to be this way, this is how things have allowed our lives to develop and transpire, through alot of constructs, which inturn can deny us parts of who we are. In some respects the concept of suicide is "liberation". How far and how one takes that "liberation" is another thing.

    It's just pretty bloody honest in a not so honest world.
  7. Forgotten_Man

    Forgotten_Man Well-Known Member

    Well you have some kind words, that is for sure. The problem is that I am not spiting anyone by staying alive. If anything I am making them happier by staying alive because they can continue to belittle me and torment me and then give their feigned charity shock and aw. I spite them much more by dying. Staying alive only gives them that weak piece of trash they need to feel wonderful about themselves.
  8. shukarumarius

    shukarumarius Member

    There are so many examples of people who want to end their lives,but they are immobilised and the family keeps them alive and pays their medication for their own happiness....some countries are starting to be permissive to euthanasia in these cases.
    But what if I'm mentally seems I should get a terminal disease somehow so people will let me do it,cause it seems physical pain is all that matters in the "real world"...
  9. dragonfly70

    dragonfly70 Well-Known Member

    I both agree and disagree here...

    yes, it is absolutely honest - there's no saying "I'm fine" when you're crying inside once you've committed the act. And yes, I think it is a release, but to call it liberating doesn't sound right to me. Yes, you are technically free from the pain of this life, but it is more of a feeling of forced escape than a true liberation. To be truly liberated, I think, involves taking a stance and rising above whatever entrapment you're experiencing, but doing so with the sense of freeing yourself and continuing to live your life. Suicide is succumbing to the entrapment and escaping through the hidden door, but not truly liberating yourself from what bound you.
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 6, 2012
  10. In Limbo

    In Limbo Forum Buddy

    I think for me it's not so much a seduction of suicide - although in my case it's depression as a whole which applies - I think it's more that if you've lived with it for a relatively long time - it becomes hard to let go because it is part of your personality. Although I don't like being depressed, I find that when I am in bad situations, I will often make myself worse even though I know that no good will come of it - to my mind this shows that sometimes depressed is the only state I know how to be - and the only one I'm comfortable being. I don't think one is ever truly rid of the black dog - or whatever personal metaphor you choose to use, but I do think that over time one can learn to make the bad situations and phases less frequent...

    Just my two penn'orth
  11. dragonfly70

    dragonfly70 Well-Known Member

    It sounds like these people don't deserve to be in your life.
  12. dragonfly70

    dragonfly70 Well-Known Member

    It does appear that way, doesn't it? I have heard of one case of euthanasia for mental illness, in the Netherlands, but it is still not without controversy even there.

    The thing that really burns me is when someone dies after a long battle with cancer or Alzheimers or some other terminal illness, they are applauded for their bravery and how they valiantly fought their illness but lost. When someone commits suicide, the obituary typically reads something sterile like "died suddenly at home" or something equally innocuous. Now, I am hoping I don't die by suicide, but will be honest here in saying that I cannot guarantee that. If I do, I want my obituary to talk about the valiant fight I put up against bipolar disorder but ultimately lost.

    But I'm hoping that's not the case. :)
  13. dragonfly70

    dragonfly70 Well-Known Member

    There is an odd, melancholy comfort to depression sometimes, isn't there? We sink into it like a warm blanket, but then when we try to get out of it, we realize we're stuck and end up sinking deeper. I have issues with dissociation and feeling numb for long periods of time. Once I begin to feel again, even if that feeling is sadness or depression, I embrace it because to me it's better than nothing at that point. It's validating somehow and it is hard to differentiate where the depression (or mania for me) ends and we begin. Not a good thing, that's for sure, but it certainly does happen to me too.
  14. I think I might take a page from your book on this one, if you don't mind. When I think about it, this part really sticks with me. As obvious as it sounds to me now, honestly, it never occurred to me to make time for me and build up my own self worth.

    You should know your post has been stuck with me all day. I think I'm having one of those "aha" kind of moments, and I think it might be just enough to pull me out of the slump I'm in now. Best of luck to you on your personal growth! Deep down we're all beautiful and brilliant individuals worth, above all, our own time, attention, and love.

    Forgotten_Man. . . . I know it's tough to believe sometimes, but if it's one thing I've learned about human nature: even at their worst, those who bully us don't wish ill of us. I think the truth you do have a grasp of is they do it to feel better about their selves. It's extremely unfortunate, and inexcusable, to do so at somebody else's expense.

    Granted, I don't know your situation (and you're more than welcome to message if you need to talk), in many cases I don't think they're that much different than us. Possibly battling thoughts and feelings of their own from their own rough patches, and coping with it by acting out. With that said, I don't think anybody really feels that way about you, and you really shouldn't think it of yourself. I have to agree with my friend dragonfly, there's no such thing as human trash. You're valuable to us!!!!
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 6, 2012
  15. justMe7

    justMe7 Well-Known Member

    For yourself probably :) It's a matter of perspective and exceptionally unique for the being involved.
    "we" is a dodgy thing to attach with suicide aswell. Just my opinon..
  16. pickwithaustin

    pickwithaustin Staff Alumni

    Could be a succubus...
  17. dragonfly70

    dragonfly70 Well-Known Member

    Thank you for this. I went through the same revelation a while ago...the "I have needs??" moment. The hard part for me was accessing them without feeling guilty about it. It's a process, but I've come to know that I'm worth it. And so are you.
  18. dragonfly70

    dragonfly70 Well-Known Member

    Sorry...I meant more of a rhetorical "you". It's a little less cumbersome than saying "one" and "oneself". But yes, point taken. :)
  19. dragonfly70

    dragonfly70 Well-Known Member

    Could be...after some of the things I've experienced, I'm open to many explanations. Problem is, they generally attack in your sleep and it's theoretically pleasurable before the exhaustion hits. ;)
  20. Forgotten_Man

    Forgotten_Man Well-Known Member

    These people are not in any way a part of my life. They are people who see me on the street or in the store. People do not have to know me or be a part of my life to hate me. They just have to come in contact with me through one of their senses. That is how incredibly worthless and shitty I am. People can instinctively tell I am trash. No matter how nicely I dress, how much I smile, or how much humor I try to spread they see right through me and know I am worthless.

    Granted, I do agree I need to get my family out of my life. They cause me more stress than anyone else
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