UK immigration: positive or negative?

Discussion in 'Soap Box' started by Abacus21, May 8, 2010.

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  1. Abacus21

    Abacus21 Staff Alumni

    As I'm studying this currently at uni, and am finding it fascinating (and have done ever since we started the module in September), I was wondering what all your opinions are on it, especially seeing as it's been a relatively hot topic in the recent General Election?

    Is immigration to the UK a positive or negative thing? If not, why not - what could the UK do to improve the situation? Likewise, if it's a positive thing, why?
  2. Aurora Gory Alice

    Aurora Gory Alice Well-Known Member

    I see nothing wrong with immigration for the most part.
    Obviously mass immigration and asylum seekers can prove more problematic in the long run but I think immigration has made this country more multicultural and as someone who loves culture and loves the fact that I get to meet the world in my own back yard, I find it difficult to see the harm in it.
    I wish more countries were open to it the way Britain always has been.
  3. aoeu

    aoeu Well-Known Member

    Generally the stringent requirements to immigrate to a country cause the quality of immigrants to be higher than the quality of native-born individuals. In the US, for instance (I don't have numbers for the UK, I would suppose it works similarly), Asian individuals, despite suffering fairly widespread racism (moreso than blacks) tend to earn well over the national average because they have to be smart and educated to get into the country. I think they are in general good for the economy and country as a whole and Asian girls are hot.

    I'm from Toronto, a city with 1.5 million immigrants (half the population), and it's a nice place to live, with little crime and little hatred.
  4. cloud9

    cloud9 Well-Known Member

    Heh, found this so funny. I don't disagree, but didn't think you'd bring something like this in your argument. Who doesn't want hot girls in their country right? lol :rolleyes:
  5. aoeu

    aoeu Well-Known Member

    Actually, immigration is a bitch in that regard, not a boon: men outnumber women in China due to the one-child policy and their preference for male children; Chinese immigrants (1.3 million in Canada) would carry these numbers with them. And Asian girls tend to go for Asian guys, so the net result is a decrease in available women without a major increase in the Asian girl proportion. :(

    ...but all technicalities aside I thought it was amusing and am glad you liked it :tongue:
  6. Shogun

    Shogun Well-Known Member

    I don't think immigration is that bad really, but England is the most overcrowded country in Europe and we're going to reach a point of literally having no more room. I also think it's bad when a country has its culture replaced by new arrivals.

    I'm undecided. On one hand it's positive, but it can lead to major problems.
  7. ballinluig

    ballinluig Well-Known Member

    i dont want to seem racist and hurt anyones feelings, this is my own thought.

    i beleive that the UK has enough poverty and needs to help our own nationality folk, and many of them that live way down the breadline, live n the bare minimum of wages or pension and with more folk arriving from other countries it doesnt help. Yes they might not have a good life in their respective countries but hey, sorry folks some of us here dont either!

    i know some people who have come from abroard and they get places to live, money for furniture, money for food etc and i have to work and accept handouts from family members because its the only way i can live. This isnt a extragavan life styl. its so my kids have hot school lunch, money to pay the rent,

    yes u can live on the dole and benefits but thats not the answer surely??
    i do hold my hand up and say yes i get child tax credit but that covers for things like new shoes, school uniforms etc. fuel for the car which i have to use cuz i live n a rural place as i cant afford the rent in the town for a place to live.
    my shopping for food is very very basic. im lucky today cuz i saw my mum yesterday and she bought me aples, oranges, pears, grapes, kiwi fruit somthing i dont buy as they are luxuries.

    so sorry dont think we should let anyone into the country, we have enough on our own doorstep!
  8. aoeu

    aoeu Well-Known Member

    I've seen this argument before and I take issue with it - unless you're farming, how much space do you need per person? There's a lot of free space in the UK, and people live in cities in the 21st century. Land isn't worth much as a resource anymore, and using the geometric size of a country to determine anything is rather unuseful.

    Also, Belgium is denser than the UK.

    Hey, wait, 86% of the UK is "White British" in ethnicity, and only 8.3% of your population is foreign born. That's not bad at all.
    Last edited by a moderator: May 9, 2010
  9. Zurkhardo

    Zurkhardo Well-Known Member

    Good topic. I appreciate it being brought up in a genuinely fact-finding manner.

    I'm not British (I'm an American born to immigrants) but from what I've read and heard, immigration is, as a whole, a positive for the country. Immigrants tend to be singled out for all that's bad in a given country because of the ease of identifying them, their outsider status, and the relative ease of solving the 'problem' (i.e. kicking them out to alleviate poverty, rather than restructuring the economic system etc).

    All in all, immigrants are like any class of people: there's the good and the bad. All in all, immigrants bring cuisine, culture, ideas, innovation, and economic progress. Some bring crime, ignorance, poverty, and conflict. But relegating the entire concept of immigration as negative for the actions of a few is no better than thinking that all English citizens are bad because some are criminals.
  10. lonercarrot

    lonercarrot Well-Known Member

    dude, it's like a swarm of asian girls in Toronto and Vancouver. It's awesome
  11. Zurkhardo

    Zurkhardo Well-Known Member

    I should add that immigration to the UK as a whole is mostly blow-back from it's days as a global empire. The overwhelming majority of immigrants come from former colonies, colonies whose creation and cultural, linguistic, and social connection to Britain were all it's own doing.
  12. perry_mason

    perry_mason Well-Known Member

    i dsont know about uk immigration specifically biut i think should immigration only be allowed for skilled people..

    e.g. if a couintry is short on skilled peopel then it would be ok to get them from other countries etc.
  13. Abacus21

    Abacus21 Staff Alumni

    We already do - it's known as 'brain drain'. An example is Somalia, where there's 70% of all qualified doctors / nurses / medical staff in developed countries (US, UK) rather than in Somalia. We actively recruit them.

    Another couple of questions for everybody:
    What percentage of the UK do you think is made up of immigrants?
    How many asylum applications do you think the UK gets each year, and how many of those do you think are accepted?
  14. aoeu

    aoeu Well-Known Member

    8% of the population of the UK is from outside the country (first generation immigrant). 14% of the population of the UK does not have "British" as their heritage.

    That's not bad. 1/5 of Canadians are first generation immigrants - we have more immigrants than you do in both proportion and actual number. 23% of Australians are immigrants.
  15. Theseus

    Theseus Well-Known Member

    I'm not British, so what I say with regard to this topic is academic, but speaking of immigration in general, it has its good and bad points. It all depends on how you want your society to be impacted by it.

    For example, most countries would agree that economic advancement is a good goal. So letting in skilled workers and people who can contribute towards that end would be wise and 'good' in a sense. At the same time, you don't want people who'll tax the society more than they would contribute to it. So, letting in political or economic refugees, people without skills etc. wouldn't be desirable. First world countries would find it hard to maintain their status if they just let anyone in. I think the oil-rich Middle Eastern countries do this fairly well. They won't let you in without a sponsor (usually someone who can be responsible for you) and it is extremely difficult to become a citizen, but they're open to skilled people coming to work there.

    If you want to be seen as a liberal and progressive country, it's hard to turn away refugees or deport people who are in the country illegally.

    I don't have an opinion on whether the current immigration to the UK is a good or bad thing. As far as my personal view on immigration goes, I think people should be able to live, work etc. wherever they fancy, but then I'm a bleeding heart. And I already live in a city with about 14 million people, so I'm used to it.
    Last edited by a moderator: May 11, 2010
  16. plates

    plates Well-Known Member

    Positive or negative to the country, the economy or the individual immigrant?

    I was born to immigrants, many of my good friends when I was a teen were refugees, my friends were all children of immigrants. I have a lot of views about what coming to Britain did, or in some cases, it just reinforced a lot of British colonial stuff they'd learnt in the country in which they were born. None of it is too pretty...

    When I was at university I felt like an immigrant :rolleyes: "progessive or liberal" or cutting edge it liked to call itself, there were serious divisions/lack of interaction betwen home and overseas students, the vast majority of home students being white or the few south asian girls who couldn't understand why I didn't follow any religion and why I had the name I did.
    Last edited by a moderator: May 12, 2010
  17. Xaos

    Xaos Well-Known Member

    England does not = the United Kingdom
  18. aoeu

    aoeu Well-Known Member

    Uh, well, we're discussing the UK and I quoted data for the UK... Thank you for your off-topic input, however.
  19. Xaos

    Xaos Well-Known Member

    Moron, England is in the UK, how is it off-topic?
  20. aoeu

    aoeu Well-Known Member

    Irrelevant input, if you prefer. If you've got something meaningful to say, go for it. Instead of giving me trivia about the relationship between regions and countries, perhaps you could debate a point I make.
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