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Discussion in 'Opinions, Beliefs, & Points of View' started by ~Nobody~, Jun 15, 2007.

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  1. ~Nobody~

    ~Nobody~ Well-Known Member

    I've been thinking a lot about this recently, and wondered what you guys thought about it.

    Do you think vegetarianism is the best way forward?

    Do you think it's better for the environment, better for us, better for animals...

    Do you think it isn't even far enough and in an ideal world we would all be vegan?

    Do you think meat is fine if it's free range, or do you think meat is always fine regardless?

    Do you believe eating meat is wrong/right because of your religious views?

    And that endless contention - is eating fish cheating? :tongue:

    These are just starting points of course, not a list of exact questions. I'm just curious :smile:. Debate away.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 15, 2007
  2. ~CazzaAngel~

    ~CazzaAngel~ Staff Alumni

    I guess in my view it's up to the person and all has the right to their choices, but I personally don't like the fact of the neglect and abuse and tortures the cattle and animals go through before even being killed, I am not vegan though, I am a vegitarian. A vegan doesn't eat/drink dairy and etc. I feel really bad about the animals, I've never been a big meat eater and now I can't bring myself to it, it makes me sick thinking about it. But hey that's just me...
  3. hammockmonkey

    hammockmonkey Well-Known Member

    Do you think vegetarianism is the best way forward?
    To where? Um, no?

    Do you think it's better for the environment, better for us, better for animals...
    I don't think it is better for the enviroment if we are all vegetarians. It's very healthy to eat meat, in moderation and carefully. I hate the industrial meat industry. I also hate the industrial style agriculture that we in the US have. It is retarded and is incredible damaging to our land. We have been give (or we have taken) the best agricultural land in the world and we are quickly destroying it.

    Do you think it isn't even far enough and in an ideal world we would all be vegan?
    I don't think so, milk is great! Butter is great! Meat is great, I'd never give them up. So, in my ideal world I'd still be eating meat and animal products.

    Do you think meat is fine if it's free range, or do you think meat is always fine regardless?
    I prefer free range meats. (I usually shop at an organic and biodynamic farm in Upstate NY, Hawthorne Valley Farm. They have stand down in the City if you live there.) But I do buy meats that are not free range, I don't really like too. But some times you have too. I also like to buy my veggies locally whenever possible. I hope everyone, vegetarians, omnivores, vegans buys their food locally.

    Do you believe eating meat is wrong/right because of your religious views?
    Nope, though I'm not really religious.

    And that endless contention - is eating fish cheating?
    Hell no.
  4. rd9671

    rd9671 Guest

    I am not a vegetarian, I do eat meat, however, I do not buy meat for myself to eat. I will eat if meat is offered to me this includes fish. Basically no sentient beings.
  5. Umm.... i don't think vegetarianism is the best way forward, since then there would be practically no need for many animals, and farmers who rear cattle would be out of a job, which would make major dents in the global economy

    I do think that vegetarianism is better for the environment in some ways, although also not in other ways, in my opinion it is equal for and against

    If everyone in the world was vegan then there would be no use for animals what so ever, if nobody needed them for food, and nobody used them for transportation or cultivational purposes their only use would be for their skins/ horns etc and then what would be done with the flesh?? So no, an ideal world would not be a place where everybody was vegan.

    I think that if meat MUST be consumed then it should be free range, if we have to kill animals for ourselves then surely the least we can do is make sure it has a decent life until then.

    Yes, if you are vegetarian then eating fish is cheating. If you want to eat fish then you should call yourself pescitarian instead :D

    And saying all of this, i am vegetarian, and some of the stuff i have said here has contradicted my beliefs, but i was thinking on a global scale, if everybody in the world could be veggie/vegan with no reprecutions on the economy/animals/environment then i would fully support it :D

    The end.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 27, 2007
  6. AngelInSilence

    AngelInSilence New Member

    I am not a vegetarian
    I think that it is completely up to the person whether they chose to be vegetarian or not. Whether it is the best way forward too is a matter of opinion and personally i don't think it really matters. As long as a diet remains balanced with protein and such then it has little effect on halth and i don't think the environment is affected at all.
    Again it depends on opinion for religous views and what type of meat is eaten-i have a christian friend who eats only halal meat but she eats fish (and shes completely british). It depends on why you are becoming vegetarian as to whether you eat fish or not and also opinion. everyone has different reasoning.
  7. theleastofthese

    theleastofthese SF Friend Staff Alumni

    I am vegetarian and I do believe it would be better if we ate far less meat. Food animals get huge amounts of grain (since they can't graze normally) and that grain would feed a large number of people - more people than could be fed by consuming the food animals that were fed the grain. And the argument that the farmers would be out of business - well, that's true to an extent, but most of the food animals raised, in this country at least, are raised on factory farms and not by small family farmers. The factory farms care nothing for the food animals and they pollute really badly.:mad:

    I chose to go veg cause I couldn't stand the thought of the food animals being skinned alive and suffering all manner of pain and suffering in life and death.:sad:

    It's a matter of personal choice, of course, but I do believe it would be better for our health and the environment if we were more "veg" than "carnivores".

    Just my opinion...
  8. Hae-Gi

    Hae-Gi Banned Member

    I wanted to post to this topic, when I first saw it, but due to problems with my mobile, I couldn't at that time.

    First of all, one is a vegetarian when one eats nothing from animals, insects, spiders, worms or whatever else you may think of (of course also fish). One is a lacto-vegetarian when one follows that lifestyle, but also consumes dairy products. Ovo-vegetarians also eat eggs. I myself, however, am a lacto-ovo-vegetarian. A vegan is a completely different thing; aside from being vegetarian, they also do their best to avoid killing bugs or wear clothes or shoes from animal products, and so on. Vegetarians, however, can kill bugs, or even animals, and can wear clothes or shoes from animal products. As for vegetarians... of course, since there are mites and other small bugs everywhere, one may, of course, see someone, claiming to be vegetarian, as not being this, but this thought is incorrect; only if the intake of certain creatures is needed, this thought is valid. However, of course; if someone makes an effort to eat mites and other microscopic creatures, it probably would be difficult, calling the person a vegetarian.

    Humanity isn't supposed to eat meat. This is apparent, due to the length of the large intestine in humans. Meat eating animals have short large intestines. However, it may seem that humans should eat meat, since the appendix; previously the cellulose decomposer in humans; is useless in humans. The likely reason to the lack of a functional appendix is, however, humanity's long tendency to eat meat, and reducing the intake of vegetables, long ago to this day; physically, humanity has started to become a carnivore or omnivore, but is, in fact, just a defective vegetarian. As for vitamin B12... vitamin B12 exists in many plants; the question is rather if the amount is sufficient. Plants with high amounts of vitamin B12 are comfrey, algae and apparently also alfalfa. Don't know if all algae contain it, though... probably not. Furthermore, vitamin B12 deficiency usually is caused by bad bodily absorption of it, and is common among meat eaters, as well.

    (Need to post the rest in a second post, due to limitations in the software on my mobile.)
  9. Hae-Gi

    Hae-Gi Banned Member

    This whole thing with the requirement of this, in plants, scarcely found vitamin is very odd, though, since living a vegetarian life is proven to lead to a far healthier life; not only does meat contain less appropriate protein; it also contains very bad fats (fish excluded). My assumption is that the requirement of this vitamin, in humans, is another defect in humans, caused by humanity's consumption of animal meat, since long.

    Anyway, since there are far better proteins for humans, like soy, and far better fats, and even plants with this annoying B12 vitamin, eating meat is just selfish. It also is far better for the environment, requiring far less water, for instance; cleaning procedures for water is not good for the environment. Furthermore, claiming animals aren't sentient is just cruel. How do you know some may not be similarly sentient? And those who are not as sentient, obviously must be sentient, still, in their own way; after all, they obviously do feel when you harm them. By the way, what's this about there being "no need" for animals if humans don't eat them, or otherwise use them for their purposes? What about there being no need for humans if crocodiles, hippos, black bears or polar bears don't get the chance to eat us? Just as valid a question.
  10. Esmeralda

    Esmeralda Well-Known Member

    I live in an area where if deer were not hunted and eaten, they would roam the streets and destroy not only the city but would ravage the land in general and make it uninhabitable for most living things. It's all part of the balance. We are at the top of the food chain and each species beneath us does their part to keep the animals beneath THEM under control.

    Now raising mass amounts of cows and keeping them in squalid conditions only to kill them later is obviously cruel.

    But we ARE the dominant species because of our intelligence and problem-solving capabilities and our ability to survive. I also believe that humans have FAR more value than animals, and to say they don't doesn't really make sense to me. I mean, if a monkey and a human were both drowning and you could only save one, who the hell would choose to save the monkey?

    I hate monkeys anyway just on general principal anyway.
  11. Panther

    Panther Well-Known Member

    Vegetarianism I could cope with, but massive no no no! to being a vegan, I like milk FAAAAAAAR too much.

    Whether or not it would benefit the environment is I'm afraid largely irrelevant because there's no way that the majority of the world are going to be veggies at any one time. Although, perhaps if we all saw the process involved in killing animals, we might all at least CONSIDER becoming vegetarian. But pleeeeease don't suggest being a vegan, I couldn't cope with that.
  12. Erebos

    Erebos Well-Known Member

    Vegetarians are less likely to give birth to twins. [wiki]

    I say, as long as you're not hunting endangered species to eat, anything goes. As a human, you have the natural capabilities of an omnivore.
  13. Hae-Gi

    Hae-Gi Banned Member

    Well, twins are not exactly good, from an evolutionary standpoint.

    peanut, I didn't say animals are equal to humans. Basically, the more sentient a creature is, the more I value it. I do not either say that no animal should be killed; I am well aware of the problems that would occur, without animals killing other animals, or worse, nothing killing other insects (although I hate most insects). Just saying humans shouldn't eat meat. It should be beyond humans, eating meat, anyway; the destructiveness of it should be left to less sentient beings. Not even to them, either, though, but it's obviously impossible, having it any other way... part of the reason why I hate this world. I hate having to eat anything at all, however, come to think of it... it's too primitive.
  14. InnerStrength

    InnerStrength Well-Known Member

    Well, from my research meat is reportetedly vital for atleast one major horome in the body, Testosterone. But, science really can't explain why even though studies prove that it heavily supports this hormone as well as muscle gain.

    But, maybe the information I've been reading is biased.
  15. me1

    me1 Well-Known Member

    ......Fangs, sharp beak or claws?
  16. Datsik

    Datsik Forum Buddy

    I'm a vegeterian, and being so is the best ^^
  17. Esmeralda

    Esmeralda Well-Known Member

    Here I go sounding selfish :) But meat is delicious. Now I very rarely eat red meat...I mostly stick to chicken and fish, but when I do, I like it nearly raw.

    Also, humans are designed to eat meat. The person above is correct in saying we are the quintessential omnivores. Our front teeth are for cutting meat, while our back teeth are flat for chewing all kinds of food (grinding).

    People say (falsely) that vegetarianism is better for your health, but truthfully, the best diet (the one that will help you live the longest with no disease) is called the Okinawa diet. People there generally live to be around 100 or so, and when they die, they just die of plain old age, not cancer or Parkinson's or some other debilitating illness and they are almost never overweight. They are usually still capable of living on their own, tending their own gardens, exercise, etc at this age. The diet consists of a LOT of fish, SOME chicken, very little red meat, and "good" carbohydrates such as brown rice and sweet potatoes.
  18. LetItGo

    LetItGo Staff Alumni

    Im sure genetics are at play there....in a big, big way. I tend to agree though, fish is top of tree in terms of animal meat...whether the worlds oceans could sustain everyone eating a lot more fish is pretty doubtful (as in no hope), guess fish farming then comes into its own. Pity the best fish is also very expensive...at least where I live.
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 13, 2007
  19. ~CazzaAngel~

    ~CazzaAngel~ Staff Alumni

    :clap: :clap: :clap: Lets hear it for Least!!!!!!!!! :thumbup: :hug:
  20. ~CazzaAngel~

    ~CazzaAngel~ Staff Alumni

    I've seen this. It's awful not only is the killing and skinning and scorching alive, they are held in small spaces to live in their own urine and fecal matter, they are shocked, burned and hit, kicked, whipped, that's just the process they live in. I can't deal with knowing that I'm eating another thing that's lived an awful life when it doesn't have to come to this to survive, not to mention the growth hormones they give them that make them so big they go lame but also isn't healthy. This is my opinion once again. But if you all want to eat meat that's your right, your opinion and your business. Sorry i'll shut up now. :zipped:
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