We're America : get off our backs

Discussion in 'Soap Box' started by Prof.Bruttenholm, Feb 19, 2011.

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  1. Prof.Bruttenholm

    Prof.Bruttenholm Well-Known Member

    I made this comment in a different thread but I am tired...tired of being treated like crap by people from other countries because I am American.

    1. We're the worlds premier super power
    2. Even with our current recession and deficit, we have more money than China
    3. We have charities and real organizations trying to help everyone, in our own country and in pretty much every other country
    4. Whenever we help, we get told we're not doing enough, we did too much or we didn't do it right
    5. When we do nothing, we get blamed by other powerful countries, like England, no offense, I love England, but you have money too, why don't you spend some helping everyone else?
    6. We may be a super power but compared to England, we're in diapers, so whenever you need help (not that you'd ask for it, you'd just whine until we help you-again, please, no offense meant-) it's like asking a two year old to help a 97 year old with glaucoma and Alzheimer s to open a jar of pickles.
    7. We try damn it, we try hard, but at anyone time we have more than 4 million homeless people wandering out streets, my own state has more than a thousand children living without homes and starving, charity begins at home, we should pull all of our money and stock out of your countries and put it back into our own, once the U.S.A. is a shining utopia, then we'll help you, until then, pray that China will help and not conquer you in the process or that N.Korea won't get bored because we won't be regulating them anymore.
     
  2. World domination is definately on China's agenda.

    Let's blow up their country and it's citizens before it's too late, just to be safe.


    In England it's the same, Islamic fundamentalists are bringing us down from within, I'm worried that I will have to wear a Bhurka one day.
     
  3. jota1

    jota1 Well-Known Member

    1 yes
    2 Yes and no...you have more debt also.
    3 So have other countries!
    4 True, socialist idiots than cant face America because it might prove them wrong. If a liberal country works then all their social manipulating theories go down the tube!

    5 Yes and No... again socialist Europe.
    6 I wont comment im not british.
    7 True, charity starts at home but the socialists are all doogooders, can never admit they are wrong and its much more credible for them to help abroad rather than at home.

    China is already a problem, its sucking all our money, but its our fault for sending all manufacturing down there. At the moment R&D are still in US/Europe but these guys are very intelligent so one day they will have manufacturing and R&D all at the same place, whats left for us?

    8 Its a big misunderstanding to think that Europeans dont like Americans, dont let the media headlines influence you.

    US is still a great country. Id love to live there, maybe when I retire!
     
  4. to Jota, why are socialists Idiots?

    I agreed with all of your post, except that statement.

    I've known people who are that way based on sound reasoning of their situation in life. There is a need for a socialist, I would say, in all communities.

    I am a Communist, as that is my job, what I'm paid to be. A socialist then is a socialist as that is what they are paid to be.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 19, 2011
  5. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Well-Known Member

    Fair or no, it's because of this OP.

    Oh yes.

    I know plenty of Americans that are decent reasonable people but amongst developed worlds America has the most nutters in power; people that can reasonable expect to defund Planned Parenthood or push creationism into schools.
     
  6. jota1

    jota1 Well-Known Member

    Your probably correct, there is a need of a socialist in every community, checks and balances! Too much power in one faction leads to abuse of power.

    Im afraid that in the last 15 years +- there was an overwhelming presence of socialism in Europe that changed society in a very bad way. We have become complacent, subsidy/state dependent and overwhelmingly patronizing in our search for equality, political correctness and the famous multiculturalism.

    It funded itself on capitalism whilst trying to implement socialism and we got this terrible hybrid that just corrupted everything we stood for. We are confused about our identity, we turn to the state when there is the slightest problem we believe that everything has to be free without knowing where the money is coming from, our moral values have been questioned to death, we do not have a work ethic, etc...

    honest to god we are in a terrible mess.
     
  7. Issaccs

    Issaccs Well-Known Member

    I'm with Lovecraft, the only thing we really laugh about the American people is the influence of the Evangelicals in politics, and even then, we really dont care that much to even think on it.
    However you dont do yourself favours with this ignorance of America = Capitalist, Europe = Socialist when all the respective governments being mentioned run the countries involved in the more or less the same Market Liberal style of governance.
    What else can Americans call their government institutions, the federal reserve, the DMV, social security, medicaid, disability e.t.c if not socialist.
     
  8. jota1

    jota1 Well-Known Member

    have you lived in the US and compared it to living in the UK. I have done both and I can tell you that the openness and work ethic of the americans beats that of most Europeans countries. There is socialism and socialism. If you consider the Americans socialist then please make it come to Europe.
     
  9. whoaaxxsamm

    whoaaxxsamm Well-Known Member

    Well, in my opinion, in the end, I don't think we have much control over what our Countries do, or don't do. We vote, and that's pretty much it.

    Everyone is different, and I don't necessarily think that our Country should define us. Sure, it's a part of us, but it's not WHO we are.

    People will always have something negative to say about each and every Country, and there will forever be rivals.

    I mean, unfortunately, it's just how things are. This world can be a pretty nasty place sometimes.

    I know, I'm kind of annoying, but I think that you should just do what YOU think is right, and never mind what others think, they will always have their opinions.

    The only thing you can control, is your actions, not the actions of your fellow Americans. So, I mean, if you are doing what you think is right, than the comments of others should roll off of your shoulders.

    I am Canadian, and you probably already know that for some reason, Americans and Canadians clash. I personally think it's entertaining. My best friend is American, so I don't judge people based on where they were born, or were they presently live.

    I am proud to be Canadian, and if people want to judge me for the mistakes others in my country have made, that's up to them, but I am doing what's right in my life, and that's what matters.

    Does that make any sense at all, or am I just rambling? LOL
     
  10. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Well-Known Member

    I'd also contend that America's two party system is more open to that form of corruption than a parliamentary system with many parties. Ex: In Canada's last election the PC party won the election with 38% of the vote. This means they're a minority government, that is to say that even though they have the most seats in parliament if all the other parties in parliament shoot a bill down the PC party can't do anything about it.

    I think one of the best things America could do for it's political life in abolish the current Democrats and Republicans and create a more diverse party system.

    I dunno, Toronto is the most multicultural place on Earth (According to UNESCO) and things are pretty damn dandy here. We have no real majority population of any given race or ethnicity, we have few religious nutter - There are mosques, churches, and places of worship of all kind everywhere and I can't tell you the last time anyone did something overtly racist like murder, beatings or vandalism related to prejudice, etc. We can walk into the hospitals and get care or go see a family doctor on the government just fine, we can call up free advice from dietitians, debt assistance and others on the government and we can get a rebate on environmentally friendly toilets and cars on the government.

    Things are going pretty smoothly here. IT's been this way a long time and things are great here; In face our housing market in Toronto got BETTER between now and 10 years ago while America is seeing houses go for dimes.

    Socialism and capitalism are not mutually exclusive; communism and capitalism are. In Canada the majority of doctors are self-employed or a member of a private organization - The government runs a few hospitals but many are private entities that take in patients as they would in the US. The difference is that any Canadian citizen or permanent residents have a card issued by the province with an insurance number on it and the hospital can send the bill to the province for the care rendered.

    The money comes from taxes - that is, us! Canada takes more out of you but gives a lot more to you. Simple.

    There are always problems, I think that the US' main problem right now is the move to the government offering more services but the stigma on taxes remains. I've payed 14% tax on anything I bought in store for my whole life but don't mind at all seeing as I've cost the government more than I've payed out as it stands - I got a full years' worth of mental health care with room and board, accredited teachers and all on the province of Ontario. My dad got 5 years worth of oncology treatments from a well recognized oncology hospital including 3 extensive surgeries on the province of Ontario.

    I'm more than willing to keep doling out 14% tax on all products and more during income tax in the knowledge that I'm assisting other families never have to worry that sudden cancer onset will make them choose between treatment or selling the house; never having to worry that another schizophrenic episode will make them choose between working off debt for a decade or suffering without a psychiatrist to help them.
     
  11. Deleted SKU

    Deleted SKU Well-Known Member

    Just a couple of points to make (not just to the original post, but to other replies in this thread).

    America are one of the least charitable countries in the world, to those outside it's borders, as a percentage of GDP. Only 0.19% of GDP is spent on aid. The UK is a country mentioned in this, but the UK offers 0.48% of it's GDP (2.5 times as much). Both of which fail in comparison with the UN target of 0.7%, which smaller countries, such as Sweden, Norway, Denmark, and the Netherlands all manage (even Luxembourg manages this).

    Deregulated capitalism was the cause of the global meltdown. The reason that many nations in Europe, and across the world, weathered the storm much better, is because of more robust regulations in place to stop the abuse of financial power for the sake of individual greed. Socialism has been proven not to work, but neither does capitalism. It's just that it is easier to gain power in a capitalist system, so those at the top are able to then run things to their liking, and the detriment of everyone else. I would assert that if the US stopped giving foreign aid tomorrow, it would be more likely that the money would go towards tax cuts, than helping those 4 million homeless people, and thousands of starving children. I would also argue that a mixed market economy, that embraces the best of capitalism and socialism, for the needs of individuals and for everyone, is the most viable system considering the fallibility of humanity. I would consider the ideal world to be one with a libertarian structure, and communist mentality, where there is no need for regulation, because no-one is left behind. But that wouldn't work, so we do the best we can.

    Finally, i'd state that there is a difference between America, and being American. I dislike much about America, for rational reasons, the same way i dislike many countries, again for rational reasons. People might agree or disagree with those reasons, and that's fair enough. Power and wealth don't make it immune from criticisms. And particular groups in America do tend to get a bad image worldwide due to the sheer absurdity of the viewpoint they try to force on others. But most people are intelligent enough not to be racist in these views, and would judge an American by the same standards they would judge anyone else in the world.
     
  12. jota1

    jota1 Well-Known Member

    Your over simplifying everything. I dont have enough time to respost but never forget that canada gives a lot to its citizens because it has raw materials to sell and to use. This bounty gives some social harmony, just wait a few more years.
     
  13. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Well-Known Member

    The US as a higher GDP per capita than Canada; you've more money bouncing around
     
  14. itmahanh

    itmahanh Senior Member & Antiquities Friend

    Yes please take care of yoursleves. Get your debts and problems cleaned up within instead of looking elsewhere for the money that you need. Your government is proposing a tax on all Canadians and other travellers that come to the USA by plane or boat. And after all the shit that went down to establish freetrade between our two countries now you want to charge an import tax on all things Canadian.

    I would beg to differ that Canada has it's shit together much better than the USA. We have our homeless and down trodden too but we arent looking at everyone else for hand outs. Canada has always been the welcoming, generous and courteous neighbor to the north. But we are really starting to get a toehole in the world. Our dollar has been at par and even better than for about 1/2 a year now, showing a strength in foreign markets and investors. Better wake up USA.

    And I dont mean this in a slanderous way to any US members here. It's all politics. We may elect the people that run our countries but we certainly dont seem to be able to direct their choices or decisions. So anything I've stated is directed at the politic figures rather than the citizens.
     
  15. I think I was defending socialism out of diplomatic motives earlier, it doesn't need me to defend it.
     
  16. Prof.Bruttenholm

    Prof.Bruttenholm Well-Known Member

    Ha! I set off one stink bomb and you all scatter around like chickens with your heads cut off.

    I like how no one truly said "We're all humans and no one is perfect" you were all so quick to start either trying to defend America or put it down or explain government standards.

    Predictable. I love the soap box threads, it's fun watching human thought processes.
     
  17. whoaaxxsamm

    whoaaxxsamm Well-Known Member


    but, but, but... what about what I said? :(
     
  18. NoMoneyToPlease

    NoMoneyToPlease Banned Member

    Do you know why America is so great and will continue to be so great?
    It's because of the the protestant work ethic,that's why.

    It's been in place ever since the first black slaves started working on the plantations.Then it was displayed again when the Chinese built the railways and it is still in operation today with all those foreign sweat shop children working their little hearts out for the large corporations.

    Pure unadulterated American graft.

    We WILL get off our backs and do something about this recession.Why only the other day there was an item on the news about previously undiscovered tribes being found in Brazil.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 20, 2011
  19. Viro

    Viro Well-Known Member

    A country cannot be great. An individual can.

    You have great people, and pathetic ones. You can't make a generalization about your country in general.
     
  20. jota1

    jota1 Well-Known Member

    Its not a stink bomb its something that affects all our lives, yours included. If it was meant as a provocative post then well done.
     
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