What does the Crucifixion mean to you?

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#22
Re: Is there a God?

Dear Lightbeam - you said: 'It's your job to preach 'unto the ends of the earth'.'

Who please told you that I have to do that?

It certainly is news to me.

With love - Aquarius​
 
#24
Although I have been known to visit churches and also to take part in their services, as well as enjoying them, I have every intention of remaining the free spirit I always have been. Not by any stretch of the imagination could anyone call me a bible thumper.

With love - Aquarius​
 

hornbeam

Well-Known Member
#26
If any of you would read Aquarius o.p. through and take your time please you will see he is NOT teaching about the crucifixion. He is giving his own interpretation of it - which we are all entitled to do whether or not we believe in Jesus.
 

Mr. Goldstein

Well-Known Member
#27
Re: Is there a God?

Naturally, I can merely speak for myself and I see the matter as follows: Yes, I do not only believe but know that there is a God – to be more precise – a Creator, because I intuitively feel and know that there is one. Yet, I wouldn’t dream of categorically stating that this is the case. To me, like all great ideas, it’s very simple really. How could there be a Creation without a Creator? It’s got to have been created by something or someone. In my view, the answers to all our questions of a spiritual nature depend on everyone’s own perception and level of awareness. This especially applies to how and what we imagine God to be. Is it a being or is it the all-pervading energy that manifests itself in humankind as that which is good and right and holy? Or could it be the love we feel and the kindness we give to each other, without expecting anything in return?

I believe the latter to be true, but because we all have a different perception of our world and only one window into it – our own –, we are the only ones who can and indeed have to decide what the Divine or anything else means to us. To my mind, different ways of looking at the same issues, with which humankind has been struggling since time immemorial, do not render one or the other wrong or in some way inferior to another, maybe even misguided and purposely misleading.

From ‘Is there a God?’

With love and light,
Aquarius​
If your religious convictions are so strong, and the energy of your god permeates every atom of your body, what are you doing in this forum? Why are you depressed? You believe that a very powerful god is always by your side, and that this god will give you eternal happiness in Heaven. Shouldn't you be completely elated during every waking moment?
 

lightbeam

Antiquities Friend
#28
Re: Is there a God?

If your religious convictions are so strong, and the energy of your god permeates every atom of your body, what are you doing in this forum? Why are you depressed? You believe that a very powerful god is always by your side, and that this god will give you eternal happiness in Heaven. Shouldn't you be completely elated during every waking moment?
I have to agree with this. What are you doing frequenting a suicide forum?
 
#29
Re: Is there a God?

i believe in God. but doesn't mean i dont have feelings and cant feel down or have mental health issues. a belief in God doesn't make you necessarily well either physically or mentally.
 

Mr. Goldstein

Well-Known Member
#30
Re: Is there a God?

i believe in God. but doesn't mean i dont have feelings and cant feel down or have mental health issues. a belief in God doesn't make you necessarily well either physically or mentally.
But it doesn't make any sense to be depressed if you believe in a god. No matter what problems you have, you know that your god will make everything better, and you know that there is a godly purpose to any misfortunes in your life. Therefore, there is nothing to be depressed about. The only ones who can have a legit claim to depression are atheists and agnostics. To claim to be depressed and also claim to believe in a god means that the person is not being sincere about his belief in the god in question, for to believe in a god precludes depression.

This may sound pretty callous, but I have no sympathies for depressed people who believe in gods, because there really is no reason for these people to be depressed. Lost a loved one? No big deal: you will see them again in Heaven. Are you poor? No big deal: you will get all the gold you desire in Heaven. Do you have a physical disability? No big deal: you will become superman in Heaven.
 
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#31
Re: Is there a God?

you make depression sound like it is something you consciously decide to have or not to have. you are mistaken my friend :) im not willing to get into arguments about the existence or not of God - i believe we are all entitled to our opinions without people shouting us down. but mental health problems are not something you choose or have 'reasons' as you put it. its a bit like saying if you believe in God you wouldn't have a broken leg.
 
#32
Re: Is there a God?

To believe in God does not preclude depression. I am what I would term a 'lapsed agnostic'. I have a growing faith in God, and I find strength in a burgeoning - if largely homespun - form of Christianity.

Having said that, your second paragraph is difficult to read. I have lost loved ones who I hope one day to meet again. Knowing that does not always dull the pain of my loss, just as knowing that a physical injury - such as a broken leg - will heal, does not mean that it isn't distressing at the time.
 

Mr. Goldstein

Well-Known Member
#33
Re: Is there a God?

you make depression sound like it is something you consciously decide to have or not to have. you are mistaken my friend :) im not willing to get into arguments about the existence or not of God - i believe we are all entitled to our opinions without people shouting us down. but mental health problems are not something you choose or have 'reasons' as you put it. its a bit like saying if you believe in God you wouldn't have a broken leg.
If one is genetically predisposed to depression, then he/she should not worship their god, for their god is cruel for allowing them to be depressed to such a point to where they want to kill themselves. To worship a cruel and evil god makes the worshiper evil, and thus not deserving of my sympathies. So, either way you look at, what I'm saying makes sense. And if you find my thoughts here distasteful, you need to take it up with the person who started this Jesus thread.

Personally, I follow the "don't ask, don't tell" philosophy when it comes to religion. This way, we can all have nice happy conversations.
 
#34
Re: Is there a God?

lol im afraid we will agree to disagree what you say makes no sense to me as it is God who has got me in my opinion through the tough times. and i dont actually want your sympathies as you put it anyway! i never mentioned finding your thoughts 'distasteful' though you seem to be concerned i might - but dont worry - as i said before - each to their own, im not up for preaching. my faith is exactly that - MY faith. your doubts are also that - YOUR doubts. in your mind you can be right in mine i can be. i would certainly personally never bandy round the idea that anyone on here was evil because of their belief system. i have too much respect for other people to do that :)
 

Mr. Goldstein

Well-Known Member
#35
Re: Is there a God?

I have lost loved ones who I hope one day to meet again.
Why do you "hope" to meet them? Jesus guarantees you that you WILL meet them. Maybe your faith is not that strong after all.

Knowing that does not always dull the pain of my loss
Then I again question the strength of your faith. A person's lost loved one is partying it up in Heaven, having a blast! A true Christian should be very happy that their loved one left the cruel earth and went to Heaven. Plus, the family member left on earth will only have to wait anywhere from a few years to 76 years before they die and meet them in Heaven, a very small amount of time compared to the infinite existence of Heaven. There is no need to be depressed, unless the person is a fake Christian.
 

lightbeam

Antiquities Friend
#36
Re: Is there a God?

you make depression sound like it is something you consciously decide to have or not to have. you are mistaken my friend :) im not willing to get into arguments about the existence or not of God - i believe we are all entitled to our opinions without people shouting us down. but mental health problems are not something you choose or have 'reasons' as you put it. its a bit like saying if you believe in God you wouldn't have a broken leg.
Actually, according to the Mormons, you chose this affliction (depression) when you came to earth to be tested in an effort to reach godhood, or goddess-hood, repectively.

Religion warps everything, and I feel really sad for people that 'believe', and are suffering because of said belief.
 

Mr. Goldstein

Well-Known Member
#37
Are the Greek gods better than Jesus? They have more respect for humans than Jesus. For example, Jesus sits on his high horse, not ever wanting to come down to Earth, ever, to mix it up with humans. Jesus does not want to befoul himself by ever coming in contact with humans.

On the other hand, the Greek gods have always come down to Earth to mix it up with people. For example, many of the gods, like Apollo and Ares, come down to Earth to have sex with humans. Aphrodite also does this. Apollo also comes down to harass humans for fun, and Ares comes down to kill people and destroy towns.

The Greek gods also allow spirits, monsters, and other weird entities to come to Earth and directly interact with people. Not only that, but when people pray to a Greek god, they often respond with direct action.

So what is better: an arrogant conceited Jesus that never under any circumstances interacts with humans, or Greek gods, who even though sometimes cause trouble for humans, at least directly interacts with us, letting us know that we are significant enough to them to mix it up with us?
 
#38
Mr Goldstein gosh for someone who doesn't know Jesus you know a helluva lot about him and are indeed contradicting the only information we DO have about him - i wish i was able to look back like you over 2000 years and have such a knowledge :rofl: you seem to be quite comfortably ignoring:
"lol im afraid we will agree to disagree what you say makes no sense to me as it is God who has got me in my opinion through the tough times. and i dont actually want your sympathies as you put it anyway! i never mentioned finding your thoughts 'distasteful' though you seem to be concerned i might - but dont worry - as i said before - each to their own, im not up for preaching. my faith is exactly that - MY faith. your doubts are also that - YOUR doubts. in your mind you can be right in mine i can be. i would certainly personally never bandy round the idea that anyone on here was evil because of their belief system. i have too much respect for other people to do that :) "

lightbeam yes... but i am not a mormon! You are right, it is sad when people suffer for their religion. I personally never had done so, as it has provided me with a great deal of comfort, continuity and strength.

thats me respectfully over and out in this conversation lol... each to their own. im not here to try and make you believe and im sure your not here to try and make me not believe! so :shake:
 
#39
If any of you would read Aquarius o.p. through and take your time please you will see he is NOT teaching about the crucifixion. He is giving his own interpretation of it - which we are all entitled to do whether or not we believe in Jesus.
Thank you, dear Hornbeam, for your support. It is very much appreciated. You expressed what is at stake here better than I could have done. Thank you for that, too.

The Crucifixion’ is my attempt at explaining that this event as part of the life story of the Master Jesus, as much as all the rest of it, is but a legend and a myth. It’s highly unlikely that you would get this kind of statement from someone with a church background. Here is a repeat of the most essential part:

To me, the Jesus legend is a re-enactment of a drama of vast Cosmic proportions, many different versions of which have been presented to us and our world, throughout the ages To this day, many believe that the tale of the Crucifixion and the Master’s subsequent resurrection describe events that actually took place on the Earth plane, two thousand years ago. In truth, it is an allegory of life after death of the physical body. The whole life of Jesus describes the process of purification that a lifetime of pure and wholesome living achieves to help us gain complete mastery and control over all aspects of our being. That is why every religion down the ages has contained allegories of saviours and their ensuing resurrection and final release into their eternal home and the oneness with God.

The crucifixion story of the Master Jesus is no exception. It represents the Earth initiation, the highest initiation all human souls must eventually undergo. When our indwelling spirit has finally gained complete mastery of the atoms of our physical body, it has been accomplished. This is what the Universe requires from all of us, when we are ready to move on to lessons of a higher nature on other levels of life. To allow this to happen, we reach an evolutionary point when it becomes necessary that we slowly begin to rise above the material world and its concerns. This gradually frees our spirit and continues until our spirit is fully and consciously re-united and one again with God, the way it once was.

The story of the crucifixion demonstrates how a Master soul whole-heartedly and willingly forgives everything and everybody, especially the one who betrayed him. We are meant to follow the Master’s example and with every passing day grow more like him. This is particularly true when it comes to forgiving all those who ever delivered us to be nailed to some kind of cross or another. Judas Iscariot’s betrayal of Jesus and the Master’s forgiveness demonstrates the need for carefully avoiding the creation of further difficult Karma between two souls.

We too are required to deal with our opponents in this masterly fashion and forgive anyone who ever trespassed against us, in the course of all our lifetimes. Even our worst opponents are waiting to be treated in this manner, to free both of us from the heavy Karmic chains and undesirable emotional bonds that we, in our ignorance of Universal laws, once created with each other, in the course of many lifetimes. Forgiving them with all our heart and soul is the only way of dissolving them. It is essential to attend to this process with great diligence, as it alone can eventually release us from the need for further earthly lessons.

With love and light,
Aquarius​
 

panoply

Banned Member
#40
For me, it resembles two-thousand years of torture, inquisition and genocide in the name of two perpendicular sticks.

Yay religion!
 
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