What makes the world go ´round?

Discussion in 'Soap Box' started by LoD, Apr 21, 2007.

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  1. LoD

    LoD Well-Known Member

    I've been thinking about this lately, what would be best for everyone and I myself have only one answer; honesty. This would make the world a great place to live, if people would just live in honesty.

    If you need further elaboration on what my question means, by all means, ask away.

    I have some opinions backing it up but I'm interested in what you people think on the matter before I influence peoples opinions with what I have to say. So please, tell me, what in your eyes would be what makes the world go around, sort to say.
  2. theleastofthese

    theleastofthese SF Friend Staff Alumni

    Honesty would be good, yes, but I think kindness is also needed to make our world a better place for all living beings. And if people would honestly ask themselves: "would I like to be treated as I treat others?" perhaps we'd have less need of law enforcement and the justice system.

    just my two cents worth...

  3. Ziggy

    Ziggy Antiquitie's Friend

    I think words are kind of meaningless compared to actions.

    If I said "I am a good person" then what do I mean by good? One day I may feel like I am a good person and another day I may not. Do I mean 'good' as compared to the Dalai Lama or as compared to Adolph Hitler? Can the statement even be true or false? Is it a meaningful thing to say in the first place? To one person I may be good and to another I may not be.

    To speak the truth there must be a truth that exists. I'm not sure that there is.
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 21, 2007
  4. ~CazzaAngel~

    ~CazzaAngel~ Staff Alumni

    I wish I knew what made the world go 'round......:sad:
  5. ~Nobody~

    ~Nobody~ Well-Known Member

    This is an interesting thread :smile:.

    LoD, I do have a question... Do you mean absolute honesty? As in 100% truth 100% of the time?
  6. LoD

    LoD Well-Known Member

    That´s impossible, unfortunately. ^^ Even though it would be best, lol. But, there are of course exceptions, such as me being honest to the agressive feelings I carry, that wouldn´t be for the best. Of course you have to add in a modest safety limiter on the truth, but next to that, complete honesty.

    Okay, I see where you´re getting at, but it´s about honesty towards others and yourself, in my vision of honesty, you wouldn't be reflecting yourself against others, cause that´s not being honest towards yourself. I'm not saying that you should not learn from them by the way.

    Read my reply to nobody, it's related to this.
    Kindness is important as well, but fake kindness is worthless, in my opinion.
  7. ~Nobody~

    ~Nobody~ Well-Known Member

    What about really basic 'white lies', such as "I think you look great" when someone doesn't. I know it sounds like a silly question but it actually needs real consideration, I think.

    I know I think of myself as being very honest, but I believe what has more value is being trustworthy. Which is different.

    Complete honesty would mean telling the voilent axe-wielding boyfriend where his girlfriend (your friend) is hiding. Being completely trustworthy would mean telling him she's somewhere else entirely!
  8. Ziggy

    Ziggy Antiquitie's Friend

    Is having optimism, hope, dreams, goals, meaning, purpose and faith being honest to yourself?

    If I get through life by lying to myself then shouldn't I lie to others as well?
    (I believe that all of the above are a mixture of truth and lies - the two can't be separated)
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 21, 2007
  9. LoD

    LoD Well-Known Member

    I was thinking of just replying with lol. :p

    Like I said, with a safety limit on it and also on the words then. But in those cases it's staying true to friends and loved ones.

    As for the 'white lie' "you're looking great", I believe that you shouldn't tell those lies. What's your worth in said matter if you can't be trusted to tell the truth? You must remember that both parties are being honest here. She wants to honestly know about how the dress looks to you and you give the honest answer.

    Same here with the 'reflecting to people', you have to realise what honestly matters.

    He hates your dress; big deal.
    She's wearing an ugly dress; still the same person.

    I believe if you live in all honesty, that looks would also care less, cause; a lot of people nowadays tend not to hang with people based on their looks. A lot of the people who do this will advertise themselves with 'I don't judge people based on their looks'. Stay honest to that and looks start to loose meaning. (I know you can turn this around, but I don't believe people would start saying; yes, I do actually care about looks, cause hey: let's be honest, looks don't say shit)
  10. ~Nobody~

    ~Nobody~ Well-Known Member

    But where do you draw the line of safety? You have to be able to define a clear line otherwise it would never work.

    Okay, I see where you're coming from now. In this world that we're talking about then the person wouldn't ask the question if they didn't want an honest answer. I hadn't even thought of that!

    But how about cases where the person wants to be told how shit they look, because they know it will drive them over the edge. To cut, to suicide, to drink... whatever. Then would it still be right to tell them they look terrible? Self destructive people might genuinely WANT the truth, but maybe what they need is a little bit different. ?

    I'm interested to hear your answers :smile:.

    I love debating this kind of stuff, that's why I'm taking Philosophy & Ethics!
  11. theleastofthese

    theleastofthese SF Friend Staff Alumni

    I read somewhere that "love doesn't make the world go round, it's what makes the ride worthwhile."
  12. Ziggy

    Ziggy Antiquitie's Friend

    I agree with Least, though I don't think 'love' is about being loved.

    I think it's about appreciating other people, our pets, nature, art, music, life etc. Whether the thoughts in my head are truth or lies doesn't matter to me too much, I simply care about the things in life that matter.

    (However although I say that now, I may not feel the same way tomorrow. So much for truth eh?)
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 21, 2007
  13. LoD

    LoD Well-Known Member

    Okay, I had some other points, but my memory is failing me. I posted it as is, if I cut short on a sentence somewhere, I apologize for that.

    I'm also taking into account in my theory what kind of impact it would have on the world when everyone is living honestly. It'd solve SO INCREDIBLY much problems. Imagine the lot of depressions which would dissipate. The eating disorders which would vanish, not all of them; I'm not saying that, but a lot of problems would just dissapear.

    Those things wouldn't fade, on the contrary, they'd gain more power.

    Optimism: things aren't looking up, I'm not going to say to myself they are if they're not. If they are though, I have to realise, accept and tell myself.
    Hope: Just a term which would loose meaning. All there is to it. Seeing as hope is often just a lie.
    Goals: Do you want to achieve it and are you willing to go for it? I think if you answered these questions honestly, goals would still be pretty useful. :p
    Dreams: I'm not saying fantasy should die. ^^
    Faith: ...? As in God?

    Not sure though, if you see a loophole in my theory, please note it. :p

    Read the reply to Ziggy if you haven't yet. ^^ It'll help explain those questions a bit too, I think.

    With the safety limit, I mean; when it would come to harm others physically or put them in danger or destroying the trust people have put in you.

    Hmmm... I'm thinking of something, not sure if it's any good or has any worth, let me know what you think; the things you now say to close friends would be the things you're more open over and the things you would NEVER EVER say to anyone would be the new things you'd only say to close friends. Not sure if that makes sense, but in my head it was good. ^^

    And as far as suicidal intentions go while asking questions, my main motive for wanting an all-out honesty, is to solve a massive amount of depressions and other mental illnesses. Because, my own mental illness would just dissolve as snow under the sun if this world were to be honest. Depressions tend to get as bad as they do because people lie to themselves and especially because they lie to others. Not saying that this is the case with everyone, because depression is still an illness, but I believe it would help in all cases if people could just talk about it, without having to hide behind false images.
  14. LoD

    LoD Well-Known Member

    I'm hoping there's no 'don't post 2 times in a row' rule here, but I'm off to bed so I won't be replying, please do continue to discuss this and I'll be here tomorrow to see any new developments.

    I'm not trying to make this thread all about honesty, if you believe something other then this is more important; give me the reasons why you think that way.
  15. MrDepressed

    MrDepressed Guest

    Personally I think compassion is more important than honesty.. definetly honestly is rated high by compassion, but compassion I think helps alleviate more depression and poverty than anything else.. I think honesty to an extent fits within compassion..
  16. LoD

    LoD Well-Known Member

    Compassion... Hmmm... Well, true enough, for the mass, it would be good. Even more realistic then honesty. Although compassion doesn´t make one satisfied with themselves... Know what I mean? For each individual, honesty would be best, imo. But for the world, compassion might be more adequite.
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