Why is suicide bad?

Discussion in 'Suicidal Thoughts and Feelings' started by hellwithhugewounds, Dec 28, 2008.

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  1. hellwithhugewounds

    hellwithhugewounds Well-Known Member

    Being in a debating squad at my local high school, I've learned and trained myself to argue on both sides of an issue to the point where I question everything (almost) before I accept it. So even though this may seem stupid and obvious, I feel that this is a question I need answered before I end myself. so...

    If your answer includes morals or religion, please be extra clear in your justifications

    Please be specific with all your answers, thanks :biggrin:

  2. Petal

    Petal SF dreamer Staff Member Safety & Support SF Supporter

    I don't think anyone will join in this debate. Not many people here think suicide is bad :unsure:
  3. hellwithhugewounds

    hellwithhugewounds Well-Known Member

    that's kinda strange since this is a forum aimed at stopping suicides, I would think there are alot of people who thinks suicide is bad. :anyone:
  4. Petal

    Petal SF dreamer Staff Member Safety & Support SF Supporter

    Yes, we are strongly against suicide but we don't think its selfish etc.. At least I think that's what most people here think. I could be wrong:unsure:
  5. Pingu

    Pingu Well-Known Member

    once you suicide you're never coming back..
  6. HappyAZaClaM

    HappyAZaClaM Guest

    you want to debate? uh...good luck. first of all, your question is a
    loaded one. BAD is a smidge on the simplistic judgemental side in
    terms of the ability to have a logical debate using that term.
    BAD WRONG EVIL etc.. that is someones opinion, not mine. maybe
    not yours?

    anyway, I don't want to debate. pingu already answered the question. nothing more needs to be said. ya can't change yer mind afterwards.
    I think that's why so many people sit on the fence for so long. hopefully,
    a lot of them will hop down on the side of dealing with whatever life doled
    out and say "fuck it. move on"

    hopefully you will do that. bad or good or whatever is all meaningless nonsense. the one thing suicide is is permanent, like terminal prostate
    cancer. no goin back. or as pingu said, no COMING back.

    that is the single worst thing about the very concept of suicide.
    it is not reversable.
  7. White Dove

    White Dove Well-Known Member

    what about ghosts?

    or those that believe in reincarnation.

    if ghosts and reincarnation is real, you can be a spiritual being free from pain if your a ghost and if reincarnation is real, you come back as a baby and can relive a life again?
  8. Pingu

    Pingu Well-Known Member

    there is no chance somthing like that exist
  9. HappyAZaClaM

    HappyAZaClaM Guest

    I agree with pingu. I would say there is a very SLIM miniscule chance of that stuff exsisting. he says no chance. I say not much chance. same thing.
    not the way to bet. again, if there is a God and a heaven and all that, WHY
    would anyone want to come back here? especially now. as a baby? yikes.

    well, you have to answer that yourself. do you really believe in reincarnation?
    I do not. I cannot prove it. but it makes no sense. not to me. see? you
    need to fugure that out. in the meantime, if you're not positive, it's
    not necessarily a thing to count on. what if ya came back as a republican?
    then NOBODY would like ya :laugh:

    only joking....

    just keep thinking about it. then...think about it some more. and soon
    it will be spring and we can go for walks and breathe fresh air, within reason anyway.
    and maybe things won't be too bad. know what I mean?
  10. WillST

    WillST Active Member

    You need to be more clear about what you mean by 'bad'.

    For example, is the question 'what are the arguments against permitting suicide?' or 'do you think suicide is inherently wrong' etc.

    Like I could believe suicide is 'bad' in the sense that I don't think people should do it but I may not think it is 'bad' in that people be given the right to end their own life.

    Here are some arguments those that will vary in their applicability depending on what your question is:

    - Human life has some inherent/higher value and therefore the taking of that life in all its form must be condemned. Most modern Western Civilized nations (except for the USA who are backwards on a lot of issues) have removed the death penalty as a criminal punishment because we appreciate this point. This can be grounded in moral or religious beliefs. Either way, the argument goes that human life is so important that the destruction of a human life can never be a 'good' thing. Not saying I agree with any of these just giving you the arguments.

    - No human of sound mind can ever truly want to end their life. As a species we have the desire to survive built into our genes, into our minds through evolution. The survival instinct is very strong. Therefore, the decision to end ones own life can only come from someone who is mentally unfit to make such a monumental decision.

    Its sort of circular reasoning, you can't choose to end your life because your not mentally fit to make that decision and your not mentally fit because you want to end your life. But that is one reason for not allowing suicide that relies on medical competence rather than religion/morals

    - And the third reason is the one already brought up. The often quoted and often contested/doubted (on SF) idiom, that 'suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem'. There is no going back, no changing things and 'perhaps' your problems could be fixed with time.
  11. Vanq

    Vanq Active Member

    What makes this bad rather than good? I mean, it's like they say, suicide is a permanent solution. During life, problems come and go and new ones come and the cycle pretty much continues like that until you die. Then all problems end, permanently. So I'd say that the finality of suicide can actually be seen as a point in its favor just as much as it can be seen as a negative.
  12. Pingu

    Pingu Well-Known Member

    when your depressed you make the wrong decisions, and you cant think straight. so many suicidals makes the mistake by ending their life instead of fixing their problems.. do you know how many people out there who have been suicidal, and attempted suicide several times but today is happy and live a normal life?
    your suicide also affect people around you.. family, friends, etc..
  13. Stranger1

    Stranger1 Forum Buddy & Antiquities Friend

    I'm not going to justify your question with an answer! I am not here for your amusement!!!!!!!!!!
  14. Vanq

    Vanq Active Member

    Yes, but what I'm saying is that nobody is happy permanently. It's just not how the brain works. The bar keeps moving. Happiness will inevitably fade, and so you have to chase it again and again. Obviously, depressed people can solve their problems. But that doesn't actually lead to a problem-free life; it just leads to a life free of those particular problems. Solve one problem and sooner or later you'll notice another one; solve that one, and sooner or later you'll notice another one, and so on. Essentially, as long as you're alive, all you're doing is trading old problems for new problems. You can't really run out of problems until you're dead.

    Indeed. Of course, if you don't like the people around you; if they are part of what's driving you to suicide, then this too can be turned around and used as a point in favor of suicide.
  15. Aaron

    Aaron Well-Known Member

    I think suicide can have grave consequences on the lives of those family members left behind so it would be wise to give the idea much serious thought before carrying it out...it is definately BAD for them.
  16. I-Died-In-My-Dream

    I-Died-In-My-Dream Well-Known Member

    You'll never know until you die.
  17. wheresmysheep

    wheresmysheep Staff Alumni

    i think the social stigma surrounding suicide is wrong.

    suicide can be taken on many levels; escaping horrendous life, running from your actions, being to weak to carry on, being to lazy to deal with life, being selfish, or maybe accepting the enimbitalble and just helping it happen earlier.

    either way society has a stigma attached to it IMO and your referal to it as 'BAD' shows this.

    Suicide is not bad.

    It is just objectified and then the people remaining turn it into something bad.

    think of it in the terms of someone suffering more than they can take, their personal ultimate suffering, and all they want is to be free from it, and their way of being free is by finalising their life. once that act is done they are free, free of the pain they have been suffering for however long.

    How can you say that is 'BAD'?

    but then for that arguement there is always the arguemnet that there is the unprepared person, the one that does it for a "stupid" reason, such as one fight with a friend/parent/relation of some sort, and they have not taken into consideration the fact that, yes, a sucsessful suicide is permanent, (duh) and there is no going back, some may think that the look on there 'punishers' faces will be price enough for taking their life, but how do we know we will be able to see their faces? more likely than not we wont, but we do not know till the deed is done.

    All in all, i disagree with suicide being refered to as selfish, 'BAD', evil etc etc. either way when any person who does it, in that moment that they commited their act of release, it was selfless, and in that moment, for them, RIGHT.

    just my opinion.

    (excuse my spelling)
  18. levitated-one

    levitated-one Well-Known Member

    Suicide is not any worst than people here on Earth not living their lives to their full potential. It is neither good nor bad, but there are consequences made to the Earth as a whole. Every action we take is important.

    But just in case you're thinking suicide is the end of your consciousness, you need to think again.. that's all I can say. I know this isn't the end for me.
  19. worlds edge

    worlds edge Well-Known Member

    Well, to stand your question on its head, what exactly makes suicide good? I would suggest that the act itself is a neutral thing, but that the categories of "good" or "bad" can be applied to the motivations behind the act.

    By this I mean that my belief on the matter is that the decision to live or end my life is a personal matter and, as such, as a thing in itself is beyond the need for justification to anyone else. However, I also think that were I to end my life at this point I could fairly reasonably be considered "bad" in the sense that I would leave behind a wife, a three year old son and two elderly parents, to all of whom I think I owe some sort of duty, as husband, father and son. And, quite frankly, I would apply the same category ("bad") to anyone roughly in my situation who did commit suicide.

    This does not stop me from fantasizing on regular basis about brain aneurysms, fatal heart attacks and traffic accidents for which I was not the party at fault. Pity all that garbage about creating your own reality, or that your thoughts become your reality have no basis in fact. I'm living proof that this is not the case.

    In sum, I do very much wish to be dead, but I check the impulse. And were the reasons for why I check the impulse somehow removed I am quite comfortable in stating that I would proceed, and in fairly short order. But it is off the table, alas.
  20. worlds edge

    worlds edge Well-Known Member

    Yup, because dogmatic assertions are all anyone can make in this area either pro or con.

    Okay, and I know death is the end for me. Big deal. :rolleyes:
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