Why is suicide supposed to be selfish?

Discussion in 'Soap Box' started by Valteron, Oct 3, 2008.

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  1. Valteron

    Valteron Well-Known Member

    I am genuinely puzzled by the idea that suicide is a basically selfish act. When I do it, I will indeed be doing it for me, but how does that make it selfish?

    Stop and consider. Our planet is overpopulated and we are using up our resources. A man who has already lived 6 decades and is of no real use offers to get off and stop using up space, energy, etc. And that is a selfish act?

    Perhaps the argument is that it is selfish because it hurts the people who love me. Why do people assume that legions of people love me and will be devestated by my death? The people who say that to me on this forum have no idea who I am or whether anybody would be that bothered by my death.

    Read some of my postings. Read my profile. Do I sound like the sort of person who would have loads of friends and people who care about him?

    There are people who would benefit financially by my death in terms of inheritance and insurance (yes, they do pay in case of suicide in my case). So even if they felt slightly saddened by my demise they would have lots of cash to help them get over it.:tongue:

    But let's concede for the sake of argument that one or two people would be bothered by my death. So what? Does that make me selfish?

    If a friend of yours was suffering from asthma and decided to move to Arizona for its dry climate, you might be saddened that he was moving away, but would you call that a selfish act?

    I want out of the 60 years of anxiety-ridden suffering I have endured, but I am not supposed to, because that might make a couple of people unhappy? I have to go on with my suffering so they will not have to feel sad? Who is being selfish here?
  2. Stranger1

    Stranger1 Forum Buddy & Antiquities Friend

    I don't think it is selfish. It is a decision we all must make sooner or later. I am sure if I let it overwhelm me, that my family would be hurting. My nephews don't talk much to me because I am suicidal. They say they have no use for anyone who commits. You know what I think? They can kiss my ass because they no nothing about me and what has driven me down this path.
    I am 51 and have seen alot in my lifetime. The only thing I still want to see is the grand canyon and ride the horses to the bottom. Besides that I am ready to commit . it is a dailey battle, but I use my coping skills to keep me going.
    Basically It is my decision and no one has the right to argue the point. I am not in crisis anymore but I still need to try and back the thoughts off.Take Care~Joseph~
  3. Aleth

    Aleth Well-Known Member

    Its an ideal in our society that you should always put the welfare of others before your own.
    In reality everyone pursues their own self interest to a varying degree.
    Suicide is more selfish in some situations that others, e.g. if you have children, your suicide would affect them adversely for the rest of their lives.
    But like most things, there is a broad spectrum. Some deaths hardly cause a ripple.
    You just have to weigh it for yourself. Personally, I don't believe my own suicide would be selfish, and I don't care if people want to label it as such after the event. That is there prerogative.
  4. Anime-Zodiac

    Anime-Zodiac Well-Known Member


    The reason it is seen as selfish is cuz of society. One must put there loved ones first before themselves. So with that sentence, that is why it is seen as selfish. What truly matters is what you personally think.
  5. Valteron

    Valteron Well-Known Member

    That is really my point. There are a lot of times that we have to balance what we want with the interests of other individuals or the interests of society as a whole.

    Right now I am cooking a chicken for supper. The oven will use a fair amount of energy cooking my meal. I could have done a favour to society by eating cold vegetables and fruits. But I am "selfishly" choosing hot roasted chicken, mashed potatoes and carrots.

    People who get a divorce because they can no longer stand their partner know it will hurt the children, no matter what "we still love you" nostrums they come up with. But if a marriage has become intolerable for the partners they may have to choose a path even though they will be hurting the children they love.

    Love implies obligations by both parties. I may ask why those who love me (if there are any) should ask me to go on with an intolerable life just so they will not feel bad. If somone truly loves me, perhaps I have a right to ask them, as their final act of love, to accept and respect my decision to self-liberate! Does anyone ever think of it that way?
  6. LightInTheDarkestNight

    LightInTheDarkestNight Well-Known Member

    I don't think sucide is selfish sure it can be but there are situations where it's far from it..

    I am physically ill, aches pains, fatigue, weird sensations(tingeling,burning, stinging), oN top of that my phyiscal body on the outside isn't right either.

    This makes me suffer and alot of the time I am very moody and depressed like anyone would be in my situation. Going on about stuff upsets my moms stomach, and makes her not feel well..

    At the same time I'm a financial burden it's costing a ton of money trying to get me physically better yet at the same time it's possible alot of my efforts will be in vain..

    The longer I am unwell before if it doesn't get better.. the mor eI will be rememered for being miserable and unhappy, while I am justfied with the physical suffering I am going through I don't want to be thought of that way.
  7. mike25

    mike25 Well-Known Member

    You didn't decide to be born, so perhaps you shouldn't decide to terminate your life either. You can rationalize the act of suicide via the theory of over-population, but then what makes you believe the world is over-populated? Current resources are being used up, but for all mans faults, he's always demonstrated ingenuity in the face of challenges.
    Fighting anxiety for six decades is commendable, and I'd say you have a wealth of experience to pass on. In terms of being loved, I sometimes wonder if humans are even capable of loving eachother, because they seem to love themselves too much! You're still in possession of consciousness, so in the great vastness of this universe, why not treasure it for a little longer. All the best.

  8. Valteron

    Valteron Well-Known Member

  9. Damaged Guy

    Damaged Guy New Member

  10. Anime-Zodiac

    Anime-Zodiac Well-Known Member

    Once again I agree with your points, especially when it comes to divorce.
    I guess also what if someone who is close to you wants to end their own life, they have tried what they think is every avenue and yet they are still unhappy and still want to end their life. Would you let them go through with it or would you still try to talk them out and help them seek out life.

    I can only speak for myself but I would try to talk them out of it. This then contradicts myself cuz if I wanted to end my own life despite all that I have tried then I would expect others to respect that and leave it as it is. And yet when it comes to other people, I don't want them to take their own lives.
  11. Valteron

    Valteron Well-Known Member

    Mystic, your contradictory sentiments tell me something.

    You have clearly exposed a contradiction or double-standard in your reasoning, and that is usually what happens when indoctrination and reason clash. Your reason tells you that while encouraging people to kill themselves would be a terrible thing to do, and while all death is sad, self-imposed or not, there must logically be times when a reasonable person can choose it as a valid option.

    On the other hand, our society repeats the indoctrination lines such as "Suicide is not a solution", and "Suicide is always bad". Like all indoctrination, you are not allowed to challenge the doctrines, only repeat them.

    If I were a captured soldier in possession of vital secrets, and I was pretty sure the enemy were about to torture me until I cracked and gave away the information, and then would kill me anyway; and if I had a poison pill hidden on my person that I could take. . . . . would suicide not be both an option and a solution?

    Most people would accept that the suicide of a physically ill person who is in intense terminal suffering is acceptable.

    Funny how emotional pain that has no prospect of ending is still seen as an unacceptable motive.

    After 60 years of living with my endless anxiety, on what do these Disney-esque shiny-happy eternal optimists base themselves to tell me that I can look forward to anything but another 20 or 30 years of the same, pray tell?
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 5, 2008
  12. Anime-Zodiac

    Anime-Zodiac Well-Known Member

    In one part I see a double standard but in another part I see that I put others before myself. Even if I was born and raised outside of society or in a society where they do not promote the types of things which are promoted in this society, I know I would be still pretty much similar to who I am today in terms of my core persona.
  13. Boratz

    Boratz Well-Known Member

    Here is my two cents;

    There is a fine line between suicide & death. Suicide ( i don't like the term 'suicide) to most people is a perception of weakness or a escape from unwanted dilema. True or not is irrelevant. The other side of the line is an expression of freedom.That is my situation is & I hold dear in my life. The assumption that ending someone's life is selfish is a blanket rationale. Whether I am ill or not , I will not ,cannot be a factor in my decsion. My belief is that everyone has to come to terms whatever is suited to their own decision . To face death should be a sole decision by the person not by what the people would think immaterial who is who would feel hurt by your own decision. It is not up to them how they will percieve it. The best analogy I can think of is this. Lets say I wanted to buy a particular car. I have to make the decision & it is only my decision that will matter not dicatated by anybody or the car in itself. Whether it is a piece of shit, it is me that has to face the consequences not by anyone ,loved or unloved,sickness or otherwise. The ultimate decision is mine to execute , it doen't matter whether the world will collapse becoz of my decision. We can call it selfisness or doomsday yet that is my decision. It is my freedom to exercise my will, free from coercion by this or that. I can decide to cut my own feet if that is my will. To be dictated by anyone or anything is selfish & violates my wish. When you consider someone else's idea or doctrine over my wish for the sake of whatever or whoever is an act of selfisness to yourself. Period.
  14. bluewail

    bluewail Well-Known Member

    i fully and totally concur. i've often thought exactly the same thing myself.
    if it's selfish for me to want to die so i don't suffer, but other people will, is it not just as selfish for other people to want me to live so that i suffer but they don't?
  15. SAVE_ME

    SAVE_ME Well-Known Member

    I hate it when people say to me "suicide is selfish"....doesn't help. If anything, it just makes me feel bad about feeling bad.
  16. Starlite

    Starlite Senior Member


    i will have to say i totally agree with everything you said here...i thank you for your two cents in this
  17. its not selfish...

    people always say think about the ones you are leaving behind..the ones who have tried to help you..the ones who love you...

    well what if the ones who have loved you put you in this state?
    what if the ones you want to leave behind really don't have any important value to your life...and what if the ones ho have tried to help you decided not to bother anymore...

    why should we stay here for them? why should we think about them when ...hey..they have completely forgotte about us...

    i don't really think i want to look at the people that i have disappointed day after day...it just makes everything worse..

    i think for people who say its selfish are selfish..they are only thinking about how they will cope if they lose you...everyone has someone for support..people lose people everyday..if they could deal with it then i believe so can the people in your life...
    shouldn't they be happy that you will be loved when you are gone, that for the first time in your life you will really be happy?
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