Women as ''sexual objects''.

Discussion in 'Soap Box' started by AsphyxiateOnMisery, Nov 10, 2014.

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  1. AsphyxiateOnMisery

    AsphyxiateOnMisery Well-Known Member

    A lot of women complain that men see them as nothing but sexual objects. Now, granted, in some cases that's completely true, regardless of the circumstance. However, in other cases, I fully believe that some women bring it upon themselves. They dress a certain way and then they complain that men stare at them or make derogatory sexual remarks. Like, seriously? If you don't want to be treated that way, don't dress like a you know what. And I know some women who do that tend to say that they dress that way for themselves, not for other people. I'm sorry, but I don't believe that for a second. If you were dressing that way for yourself, you'd be dressing that way when you're by yourself at home too, not just when you go out. And being a woman myself, I would be lying if I didn't say that I dress a certain way to get noticed sometimes, too, because it makes me feel attractive. Granted, it would still be extremely inappropriate, not to mention sexual harassment, to go up to a woman and, like, slap her ass or something just because she's dressed a certain way...but calling her hot or sexy is something she brings upon herself, in my opinion. What are some of your thoughts on the matter?
  2. Perfect Melancholy

    Perfect Melancholy SF Friend

    I think giving that it is 2014 women have the right to dress how they want and not be harassed, or looked at as objects. In fact I find it incredibly sad I even have to explain that. So no they do not bring it on themselves, maybe just maybe they want to dress how they want without being judged?
  3. Freya

    Freya Loves SF Staff Member ADMIN

    I think that Misery was agreeing that they have a right not to be harassed - and I hope nobody would suggest that wearing a particular thing means you open yourself up to harassment. But I do agree that if you "do yourself up" to be attractive, then complaining if a man finds you attractive is a little bit ridiculous. Of course it is inarguable that you should be able to wear what you like without being groped, molested or harassed - but if you get dolled up and go some place where men are - and men hit on you - can't really complain about that UNLESS they don't leave you alone when you ask them to - that is a different issue.

    Derogatory sexual remarks on the other hand are made by insecure asshats as a rule - and is not in any way the woman's "fault" or responsibility.
  4. Twocky61

    Twocky61 Banned Member

    Being a guy AsphyxiateonMisery, I find women dressed evocatively very sexy & attractive, I'm sure as do many guys. I see them here in Bournemouth during the summer months all the time. On Bournemouth beach some women sunbathe topless. I always assume they are aware they are sexy & the effect they have on us mere men.

    I seriously do not believe women in general bring it on themselves. I believe they want to feel good knowing they are attractive to others & I am sure they feel proud & good about themselves. Whether or not they are 'asking for it' is not the issue. A women is a person just like anyone else & is NOT a sex toy to be possessed by men, as my signature to my post states.

    Any woman subjected to sexual harrassment or even rape just because of the way she is dressed & supposedly 'asking for it' has the universal right to the protection of the judiciary. The perpetuator must be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

    Many women do not report sexual harrassment or rape because of the stigma & the fact if the perpetuator pleads not guilty in court she will thus be interrogated by the prosecution solicitor suggesting she 'asked for it; because of the way she was dressed.
  5. iicookieii

    iicookieii Active Member

    If I dress nice or sexy, its for me, not you. Women as sexual objects does not mean that you cannot find women attractive, it means that self-entitled men believe that a woman gets dressed with him and his pleasure in mind. It mens that men dont see women as functioning human beings, they see them as sexual objects created for their pleasure and their pleasure alone.

    Men have self control, period. If I go out of the house wearing a short skirt, and a man says something inappropriate to me, its not because hes a man- its because he feels as if he is entitled to make a nasty remark at me, thus putting the blame of his behavior squarely on my shoulders. The idea that men are somhow INCAPABLE of VERBALLY EXPRESSING their sexual fantasies to a woman walking down the street was created in order to keep said men from taking responsibility for their own actions and behaviors.
  6. Donnanobispacem

    Donnanobispacem Well-Known Member

    I'm too old to be seen as a sex-object, though I do remember when younger being alarmed that the men I met were either looking for short-term sexual encounters rather than relationships, or looking for relationships where they could be long-term abusive ( a few of which I fell for before realizing ) It felt like Catch 22 to be a woman frankly. And I was living in the free world.

    A lot has changed for me, I no longer need a romantic relationship or male to take care of me ( they never did really anyway! I took care of them ) but when I look at things going on around the world, the countless women who are raped as control mechanisms or punishment and the men in their cultures see it as normal for example, or the women who are told they are to blame for unacceptable male behavior and attitude. Yuk.

    We are lucky to live where we are free for self-expression. That said I think more women 'uglify' themselves than beautify these days, and I wonder if that is to make a statement to potentially threatening men- I can look after myself, I'm as strong as you, don't mess with me?

    I remember a professor in college years ago saying the world would be a better place when all men recognize and understand the phrase 'to a woman every man is a potential rapist'. There's a lot of double standards still though even in free places, and women aren't always afforded much sympathy if they try to live with the same rights as men to dress or behave as they choose and a man attacks them.
  7. Acy

    Acy Mama Bear - TLC, Common Sense Staff Member Safety & Support

    I want to sit on the fence. I don't think women who dress a little provocatively are actually thinking, "Gee, let's see if we can get some guy to harass/rape/assault me." They don;'t "deserve" to be assaulted or harassed. They are more likely hoping to feel and look kind of pretty and a little sexy - enough to catch someone's interest.

    Maybe society's trend toward immediate gratification and the sexualization and the freedom with which people engage in sex are as important to the discussion as the clothes people wear. If an outfit "advertises" sexiness, it's kind of hard to say that a woman doesn't realize some guys will read it as an open invitation The guys might want things, but just because someone is dressed pretty or hot, doesn't mean she is saying she actually available to everyone. There is more to a relationship - even in a club scene, I doubt women want all the guys to think she will out out for them.

    Maybe there's a line that gets crossed and both women and men to step back and consider if sexual availability is being advertised, or just the fact that someone "might be available; so get to know me."

    Honestly, I'm too old for this to be much of an issue for myself these days. I do wonder sometimes why some young girls don't hold back a bit more in how they dress. Mystery and specialness are lovely components in sexual exploration with a partner we know. It doens't all need to be advertised up front at the start and then over and done with without the sweet reward of more than just a "wham, bam, thank you ma'am sex encounter."

    Sorry. I'm an old fart. An old fashioned one. I liked having some mystery. I liked the chase and the little bit of tease. I liked being wooed to wear the sexier outfits for the guy who took the time to get to know me as a person, not just an object to screw. And maybe society rushes people into being in sexual relationships, and that makes sexy clothing a part of the attraction game much earlier. And some men read it as an invitation that it's ok to make a sexual play - but it's actually too soon.

    I don't know.I'm a fuddy duddy. Hold some cards close to your vest. Let some of the other non-overt sexual attributes do some of their work and magic too. I thing it makes the chase more fun and interesting, and the wait an prize more satisfying in the end.
  8. Prinnctopher's Belt

    Prinnctopher's Belt Antiquities Friend SF Supporter

    As a single 30 year-old woman, I'd be betraying my integrity if I said I don't wear pretty dresses and booty-gripping yoga pants to elicit some type of validation of just my physical appearance. I think being a good person is the most valuable trait anyone can have, but - to be quite frank - I like feeling not only mentally attractive but physically, too; I'd be crushed to find out my hypothetical companion only appreciates that I have a great personality but is otherwise unattractive or revolting. I want to feel desired in all ways, including the pie to his eye. I don't think any man would engage in a serious meaningful romance with someone he didn't find to also be physically attractive in his eyes.

    Yes; when I decide to wear the hip-hugging, curve flattering outfit to workout in, yes it is part of a strategic and deliberate mission to show off what I got (whatever it may be if I like how it looks) and feel good about it. Bam. Just being honest. But there is a "cannot touch" language that goes with it, and it really applies regardless of how someone is dressed. I'm shameless in a black dress and it has never made me less of a respectable woman, nor a size 6 might I add.

    With that said, I agree that dressing in a highly revealing way is meant to bait some type of response. But no one, man or woman, should make another person feel uncomfortable or violated for doing so. Sure, someone dressed in a tight miniskirt is going to get attention especially if she fits it well, but it's not an excuse to treat her as if she's less than a human being and justify violating her individual freedom to seek out and get as many compliments on her appearance as she wants. Not any more than driving a fancy schmancy car in public would ask for a carjacking.

    And yes, I have seen lots of guys and said in a breath of admiration "oh my god" without ever having to be inappropriate by squeezing their booties or twerking on them like Miley Cyrus or some wild, uncontrollable, raunchy pervert. But I do ogle them very intently, enjoying the view, oh yes. Yep. Shameless, I know.

    If we didn't care how others saw us, the cosmetics and weight loss and shoe industries would be obsolete. And even still, just going out in a potato sack would still evoke countless howls and whistles and the like.
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 10, 2014
  9. justMe7

    justMe7 Well-Known Member

    Some of you don't get men. While I understand and agree 100% that nothing deserves inappropriate responses, men are not 100% honorable ideological individuals.

    In my opinion we're trying to make this world better. And it starts with how we see and treat eachother. But make no mistake, our societies are maintained by some ugly and nasty methods. Methods that revolve around a preadatorial and consuming nature.

    In hind sight we should all be able to walk around naked. The only time that would become an issue is when people are on it and want to fuck. But we don't live like lions, rabbits, whatever. We wear clothes. Which has been used to separate, subjectify and objectify individuals based on the time and "place" in their culture. General standards become the Norm. So.. when someone wears something more reaviling, it is specifically done for either personal feelings or for others aswell. To sum it up.. Image. Couple that with attitude and everything else, and you're standing out.

    Whether you like it or not, clothing, or lack of will attract attention if it's worn right. You can expect the people in certain establishments to maintain some degree of decorum. Simply because they see, accept and carry that understanding with them when they enter the premise. (Generally...) But we're animals too. We have desires. So expecting men to be these well conditioned polite respectful people who you can walk past wearings something revealing that compliments a womens figure .. that's just ignorant. Understand your own social culture. Alot of men know how to control that, such as "time and a place". Some hide it, some don't care.

    I just find it interesting that some people think they can break a social barrier of the past and expect everyone to comply. The raunchier you get, the more it heightens responses in guys. Both sexes play eachother...

    Here, would you walk in the downtown core wearing a super sexy revealing dress? I mean do you feel entitled to a social standard that should shield you from responses from men? .. I hope not. Cause a great deal of us don't adhere to society standards. You have to respect the area you're walking in. Just because you share an ideology with many, doesn't mean everyone else does. Hence.. Rape. But in the end a women could walk into a bar naked, you still have no right to physically or verbally harass her. Though..I'm sure some verbal remarks would be said. But the moment you deem someone to be less because of their clothing, simply shows how little respect you have for individuals in general. All Im trying to get at is, clothing is a tool. So wearing purposely sexy clothing in todays standard, is playing a game. People play different games, and have different rules for those games...
  10. DrownedFishOnFire

    DrownedFishOnFire Quieta non movere

    No matter man or women it goes both sides of fence, some men are treated as sexual objects because of what they're wearing and some women are terrible as men with the catcalls and groping. Some women are judged harshly because they dress like a boy

    Everyone has the right to wear whatever they want, a brown paper bag, a slinky outfit, flannel shirt etc no one has the right to judge or harass someone because of their choice of clothing. Sexy or not it still is their choice what to wear.
  11. justMe7

    justMe7 Well-Known Member

    True that. But if you wear a steak suit and walk into a wolfs den, don't be surprised if some wolves smack their lips.

    It's sort of the same argument in wearing an expensive suit, with gold chains, expensive watches and diamond rings. Would you think it's wise to walk through the downtown core alone in the middle of the night like that? Respect has barriers. It all depends on if people are willing to maintain and envoke them. And while I always stand with the right to be who and what you are, and to express yourself. . You have to be wise of where you decide to stand out.
    Women get judged harshly for dressing in "male" clothing? Well that's funny
  12. AsphyxiateOnMisery

    AsphyxiateOnMisery Well-Known Member

    I just want to clarify what I meant by derogatory sexual comments. Something that compliments a feature of hers, like, "You have a nice ass'' if she's wearing something that clearly shows it off, shouldn't be taken as offensive in my opinion, unless, of course, it doesn't end there and she's clearly wanting to be left alone. But if you're talking derogatory like mentioning some kind of sexual act, that's going a little too far. Basically, compliments and staring are the extent of what I don't think should be complained about. But following her, continuing to bother her when she wants to be left alone, or touching her is different.
  13. DrownedFishOnFire

    DrownedFishOnFire Quieta non movere

    It still doesn't give people right to say it outright. Unless they know the person personally and know the person wont be offended. Its all about manners. WILL the person say the same thing if First Lady, Michelle Obama was wearing an outfit like that will the same person say "nice ass" without getting their ass kicked by secret service?
  14. justMe7

    justMe7 Well-Known Member

    Completely agree on all three counts. That's when alot of people would, or should intervene. :S Must feel horrible to get stuck on like that by someone else when you just want to enjoy yourself.
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