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Religious Views

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fromthatshow

Staff Alumni
SF Supporter
#23
Science can't prove anything. Science takes ideas, tests them and looks to see if the idea and test seem to fit. It can give credence to the idea, but never prove it, because there's always some chance that it is false, but only appears true.

Anyways, as of today, scientific inquiry is most certainly not in favour of god.
There is some quote the simplest answer is usually the correct one. Those aren't the exact words but anyway point is I think science will come to see that the universe is not complex at all but rather very simple.

I think science will eventually come to credit what religions have been practicing/teaching for years. Without all the bullshit about going to hell.
 

Lovecraft

Well-Known Member
#24
There is some quote the simplest answer is usually the correct one. Those aren't the exact words but anyway point is I think science will come to see that the universe is not complex at all but rather very simple.

I think science will eventually come to credit what religions have been practicing/teaching for years. Without all the bullshit about going to hell.
These all seem relevant.

Anything you don't understand, Mr. Rankin, you attribute to God. God for you is where you sweep away all the mysteries of the world, all the challenges to our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off and say God did it. -[Dr. Arroway in Carl Sagan's Contact (New York: Pocket Books, 1985), p. 166.]

Part of my message is that we're not central to the purpose of the Cosmos. What happened to me makes us all seem very small. [Dr. Arroway in Carl Sagan's Contact (New York: Pocket Books, 1985), p. 420.]

In many cultures it is customary to answer that God created the universe out of nothing. But this is mere temporizing. If we wish courageously to pursue the question, we must, of course ask next where God comes from? And if we decide this to be unanswerable, why not save a step and conclude that the universe has always existed? [Carl Sagan, Cosmos, page 257]

If we're capable of conjuring up terrifying monsters in childhood, why shouldn't some of us, at least on occasion, be able to fantasize something similar, something truly horrifying, a shared delusion, as adults? [Carl Sagan, The Demon Haunted World, p. 109]

If you want to save your child from polio, you can pray or you can inoculate....Try science. [Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World, p. 30, ]
 

fromthatshow

Staff Alumni
SF Supporter
#25
These all seem relevant.

Anything you don't understand, Mr. Rankin, you attribute to God. God for you is where you sweep away all the mysteries of the world, all the challenges to our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off and say God did it. -[Dr. Arroway in Carl Sagan's Contact (New York: Pocket Books, 1985), p. 166.]
That irks me when people do that what is the point. Whatever we haven't figured out is because it's God's mystery, only until we've figured it out, then it's not God's anymore :laugh:.


If you want to save your child from polio, you can pray or you can inoculate....Try science. [Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World, p. 30, ]

I think whole-hearted prayer can cure any disease or illness. I think true prayer is recognizing that illness is not an aspect of God, and therefore overlooking it in the other person, and "curing" what was never real in the first place.
 

Esmeralda

Well-Known Member
#26
It is absolutely untrue that you cannot be a theistic scientist. I personally know some who are as a matter of fact. Also, some of the greatest scientists have believed in God, and no, I'm not talking about people who existed hundreds of years ago either.
 

Lovecraft

Well-Known Member
#27
It is absolutely untrue that you cannot be a theistic scientist. I personally know some who are as a matter of fact. Also, some of the greatest scientists have believed in God, and no, I'm not talking about people who existed hundreds of years ago either.
They aren't true scientists. Perhaps they work in an area of science, like medicine, but they are not scientists. There is NO debate that god is not a valid scientific theory.
 

Lovecraft

Well-Known Member
#28
I think whole-hearted prayer can cure any disease or illness. I think true prayer is recognizing that illness is not an aspect of God, and therefore overlooking it in the other person, and "curing" what was never real in the first place.
What say you to every study ever done on prayer? They all favour one side or the other by a small enough margin to chalk up to chance, and it have favoured *each* side by that small margin.

Prayer is a scientific no-no.
 

Milton

Well-Known Member
#29
They aren't true scientists. Perhaps they work in an area of science, like medicine, but they are not scientists. There is NO debate that god is not a valid scientific theory.
Scientists seek to understand the rules that govern the universe. Isn't it possible to believe that those rules exist and that they were put in place by someone?
 

Lovecraft

Well-Known Member
#30
Scientists seek to understand the rules that govern the universe. Isn't it possible to believe that those rules exist and that they were put in place by someone?
That notion is in violation of scientific principle. It fails the Occam's razor test, and it cannot be observed or tested.
 

Milton

Well-Known Member
#31
That notion is in violation of scientific principle. It fails the Occam's razor test, and it cannot be observed or tested.
Assuming we're talking scientist as a profession (which it seems we are): so you're assuming that in order to be a scientist, one must apply the scientific method and scientific principles to all aspects of one's life. I suppose you also deny the existence of police officers who break the law?
 

Lovecraft

Well-Known Member
#32
There's plenty of credible documentation on incidences of police forces violating laws. There's no credible documentation on the existence of god/s.
 

Esmeralda

Well-Known Member
#33
They aren't true scientists. Perhaps they work in an area of science, like medicine, but they are not scientists. There is NO debate that god is not a valid scientific theory.

What criteria does one have to meet in your opinion to be a "true scientist"? Was Louis Pasteur not a true scientist? Max Planck? Kelvin? Mendel? The list goes on and on. Do you honestly call yourself a scientist and yet exclude these men from your exclusive club? :laugh:
 

Lovecraft

Well-Known Member
#34
Someone that believes in the scientific method as being the best method for gathering information.

Guys like Louis Pasteur and the like have done a lot for science, but did they really believe in the scientific method?
 

Esmeralda

Well-Known Member
#35
Someone that believes in the scientific method as being the best method for gathering information.

Guys like Louis Pasteur and the like have done a lot for science, but did they really believe in the scientific method?
But given all of the information on many different things, scientists OFTEN come to vastly different conclusions or postulate vastly different theories about certain things. The same could be true regarding whether or not God exists as well. One scientist may take the available information and believe it points to the existence of a higher power, while another might see something entirely different. All information is subject to different interpretations. It is only by gathering more information over time that we can begin to whittle away at the various possibilities. Not enough information has been obtained thus far to either prove or disprove the existence of God with any amount of certainty. In fact, many scientists argue that the more information we obtain, the greater the liklihood that God actually exists.
 

Lovecraft

Well-Known Member
#36
They disagree about things yet to be answered. Is there a Higg's boson is a shining example of that. The god theory's ship has already sailed though... Actually it sank.
 

Lovecraft

Well-Known Member
#39
I don't like English...

What I have to say is that a policeman that breaks the law exists, but isn't really a policeman. By definition, the police are to follow the law and enforce it. By definition, a scientist adheres to the scientific method. In either case, they can exit the confines of their definitions, but in doing so also lose the label.
 

Milton

Well-Known Member
#40
I don't like English...

What I have to say is that a policeman that breaks the law exists, but isn't really a policeman. By definition, the police are to follow the law and enforce it. By definition, a scientist adheres to the scientific method. In either case, they can exit the confines of their definitions, but in doing so also lose the label.
OK, I get your point. I don't agree with it, but I understand it.
 
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