@LOSTINSIGHT Did I scare you off? I'm not a serial killer. And I've mellowed with age.
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Therapy round 2
- Thread starter Dark111
- Start date
ASPD is quite different to BPD but they both fall into the cluster B category. I requested my file through the freedom of information act a few years back.
ASPD can't be diagnosed before age 18 and before then there must be a consistent pattern of conduct disorder, e.g. starting fights, starting fires, stealing, cruelty to animals, pathological lying. I was diagnosed at age 20 using the SCIID-II method and was court-ordered for treatment for a year. I was scored across the following 7 items:
1. grossly selfish
2. callous
3. irresponsible
4. impulsive
5. unable to feel guilt
6. inability to learn from experience and punishment
7. low frustration tolerance.
These are then examined in terms a personality-oriented factor and a behavior-oriented factor
So let's take the behaviour-oriented angle on some of the ASPD items to establish a pattern of disregarding others’ rights: Item 1 as expressed through a failure to conform, Item 4 as expressed through aggressiveness and Item 3 & 5 as an expressed through reckless disregard. When I did the test you had to fulfill at least five of the following seven behaviors but I think with the DSM-V it's at least three:
1.Failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors, as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest
2. Deceitfulness, as indicated by repeated lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure
3. Impulsivity or failure to plan ahead
4. Irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults
5. Reckless disregard for safety of self or others
6. Consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations
7. Lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent or rationalizing
Ain't I just a wonderful human being?
ASPD can't be diagnosed before age 18 and before then there must be a consistent pattern of conduct disorder, e.g. starting fights, starting fires, stealing, cruelty to animals, pathological lying. I was diagnosed at age 20 using the SCIID-II method and was court-ordered for treatment for a year. I was scored across the following 7 items:
1. grossly selfish
2. callous
3. irresponsible
4. impulsive
5. unable to feel guilt
6. inability to learn from experience and punishment
7. low frustration tolerance.
These are then examined in terms a personality-oriented factor and a behavior-oriented factor
So let's take the behaviour-oriented angle on some of the ASPD items to establish a pattern of disregarding others’ rights: Item 1 as expressed through a failure to conform, Item 4 as expressed through aggressiveness and Item 3 & 5 as an expressed through reckless disregard. When I did the test you had to fulfill at least five of the following seven behaviors but I think with the DSM-V it's at least three:
1.Failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors, as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest
2. Deceitfulness, as indicated by repeated lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure
3. Impulsivity or failure to plan ahead
4. Irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults
5. Reckless disregard for safety of self or others
6. Consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations
7. Lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent or rationalizing
Ain't I just a wonderful human being?
Vrs nurture in regards diagnoses and treatment.
I've always had a problem with authority myself .
If you compare that list with maslows hierarchy of needs ,how do you get on ?
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T
You're right, there is a very specific approach to treating ASPD. Back in the day it was mainly behavioural and reinforcing and rewarding good behavior. The idea was to show us how prosocial behavior was in our best interests. So instead of trying to get ud to reflect on our feelings - that just made us better manipulators - they appealed to our natural selfishness and worked with that. A process called Mentalisation was also used a lot to try to help us understand the perspective and feelings of other people. Most of the therapy was also done in groups. Less chance for a single client to get the the upper hand on a therapist with mind games and telling them what they want to hear.
I've gone back to therapy since last year because I've been dogged by these sudden depressions. They get really black and I sometimes find them paralysing. I've been through 3 therapists in the past year but this latest one reckins the fast and hard life I lived when I was younger is catching up on my now and all the plans I made that never came to fruition. High narcissism comes with my disorder and when I was younger I thought I could achieve anything. But I was ruthless about it and lost a lot of friends along the way. I only seen many of them as stepping stones.
Having said that, I've been working as software programmer for the last few years in a decent company but I'm always scared my impulsiveness and callousness towards others will kick in and I'll ruin everything.
I'd like to hear more about your story, if you have the time \nd the inclination.
You're right, there is a very specific approach to treating ASPD. Back in the day it was mainly behavioural and reinforcing and rewarding good behavior. The idea was to show us how prosocial behavior was in our best interests. So instead of trying to get ud to reflect on our feelings - that just made us better manipulators - they appealed to our natural selfishness and worked with that. A process called Mentalisation was also used a lot to try to help us understand the perspective and feelings of other people. Most of the therapy was also done in groups. Less chance for a single client to get the the upper hand on a therapist with mind games and telling them what they want to hear.
I've gone back to therapy since last year because I've been dogged by these sudden depressions. They get really black and I sometimes find them paralysing. I've been through 3 therapists in the past year but this latest one reckins the fast and hard life I lived when I was younger is catching up on my now and all the plans I made that never came to fruition. High narcissism comes with my disorder and when I was younger I thought I could achieve anything. But I was ruthless about it and lost a lot of friends along the way. I only seen many of them as stepping stones.
Having said that, I've been working as software programmer for the last few years in a decent company but I'm always scared my impulsiveness and callousness towards others will kick in and I'll ruin everything.
I'd like to hear more about your story, if you have the time \nd the inclination.
No need tonight for my story im exhausted,, a while back you were great in chatting things out on my thread.cheers.
I relate with the dark depression.
Worried your going to wreck things In work ,,does it cause anxiety for you?
Does therapy help you with pushing people away,,this must be such a concern for you from a young age .
I relate with the dark depression.
Worried your going to wreck things In work ,,does it cause anxiety for you?
Does therapy help you with pushing people away,,this must be such a concern for you from a young age .
You may be familiar with the Big 5 in psychology when assessing personality traits. It's often remembered by the acronym OCEAN: Openness, Conscientiousness, Extraversion, Agreeableness and Neuroticism. I score very low on neuroticism which means not much scares me but I'm low on agreeableness which makes me very argumentative.
Anyway, I don't want to keep you if rest & sleep beckons. Thanks for talking with me. I bet you're high in Openness.
Anyway, I don't want to keep you if rest & sleep beckons. Thanks for talking with me. I bet you're high in Openness.
Ye I've heard of the big 5 ,,,it harms my EGO to admit I can be high on neuroticism,,became very conscientious the last few years through introspection, blew my phsyci wide open .I'm an utter mess .I'm the type that hates having anxiety ,I despise it .
Very interesting your not agreeable,,one would think you would be to get "what you want" in relation to your ASPD
Very interesting your not agreeable,,one would think you would be to get "what you want" in relation to your ASPD
I hate to admit it because I'm egocentric and at times grandiose but as she points out reality is still reality and she points out the risks I wouldn't have given a second thought to when I was younger. I've lost jobs, relationships, friendships, estranged from family members and I've fallen flat on my face to many times. Having said that, I succeeded a lot too. I put my mind to becoming a software developer and here I am 5 years later in the same company and I just got a raise for exceeding performance.
Kudos ,,this will keep you on an even path ,,unless we have rich parents or win the lotto ,,we have to work ,,self preservation, let nothing get In the way of earning money ( within reason) .
Funnily enough since j got really sick and was unable to work,,its brought out an ASPD traits in me ,,no money means very few options and its complete torture ,,destroys the EGO in all the wrong ways .
Funnily enough since j got really sick and was unable to work,,its brought out an ASPD traits in me ,,no money means very few options and its complete torture ,,destroys the EGO in all the wrong ways .
