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#1
Hello, sorry for my bad English. I am a 23 year old boy, who have been depressed and suicidal for some time now (read my other thread). The last couple of months i have started to look for answers and truth about life and the essence of who i am. I sometimes started to get this feeling that we all are one and the same, and that nothing really matters. I feel that nothing is good and bad, things just simply are. Our thoughts is an illusion in our mind. We are not our thoughts, we are not even our body. There is something deeper behind. I started to look at animals and small kids, and realized how much they are in their nature of their being. For them there are no future or past, and they dont have this inner voice that holds them back from being who they are. They only have sex (the animals) when they need to reproduce, and they only eat when they need to. They are only afraid of the danger that is happening in the moment, and not what happened or will happen. I feel like that also is humans true nature, but this culture has taken us away from it. I notice how we are born in the nature of who we are, but are moving away from it from the second we are born.
I think all the answers about ourselves has to come from inside us, and not the outside. My understanding of the religions have changed. I dont believe in a God, as in a holy figure sitting up in heaven looking down on us. I believe we all are God. We are creating our own world with our consciousness. Before consciousness there are no universe, therefore we are the universe. I could go on and talk about my realization, but i do not want to bore you.
For some it may sound like a depressing thought, and it may be at times. I find it hard to talk to people about, because they think i am going crazy, and that's why i am writing here. But i really think this is the ultimate way to freedom from your mind. A lot of ego is destroying this world, and i think we need to let go of our ego. I think this is where we will find real love, compassion and forgiveness.
This feeling comes and goes, and it does not last long at a time, but at least now i know where i want to go.
So after this realization i started to read and listen to different spiritual teachers (Eckhart Tolle, Alan Watts, Sadghuru etc.)
They are all talking about this spiritual awakening, where you lose your sense of self, which sounds as a scary and amazing thing at the same time, and i dont know what to make of it.
Is this real? Has anyone tried it?
Please give me your thoughts about all of this?
 
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#2
Hi Dyreal
(((((((((HUGS)))))))
A big emphatic YES, however it is only true for you, not "we" a spiritual awakening is a personal experience, just as life itself is. Stay tuned into that feeling of oneness and revisit it often.
It's your ego that is suicidal, show it there's more to life than death, shine light at your ego.
I don't think you need a teacher, you are a teacher.
Trust
Love and Light
P
A poem or 2 for you
www.suicideforum.com/community/threads/seek.127669/
www.suicideforum.com/community/threads/one-at-a-time.133625/
 

Lara_C

Forum Pro
SF Supporter
#4
They are all talking about this spiritual awakening, where you lose your sense of self, which sounds as a scary and amazing thing at the same time, and i dont know what to make of it.
There are so many accounts of this loss of the sense of being a separate self, that I think it has to be an authentic experience, regardless of how it is described in the various spiritual traditions accross the world. In fact, I think more ' primitive' cultures were more in touch with the idea of a deeper unity of and interconnectedness of everything that exists underneath the appearance of seperateness on the surface. The feeling of transcending the ego (or sense of being a separate self) is also a common feature of ingesting certain substances and indeed ancient cultures often had rituals surrounding this. It's not recommended though because the effects of drugs are uncontrollable and unpredictable, and the experience of ego loss induced this way can be terrifying and dangerous as often, or more than, it is 'enlightening'. There is a lot of scientific research about this, but meditation is recommended as a much safer way, although it takes effort and practice over quite a long time to become stabilised.

There are also accounts in the psychological literature about 'peak experiences' of this kind which occur spontaneously across all cultures, and which seem to be quite common regardless of religious background, or lack of any religious background. It seems to be built into the brain itself and occurs whenever the right conditions are present, and these can occur spontaneously, or through a method like meditation. I think they're more common than we realize - anyone who has ever found themselves briefly absorbed in a beautiful piece of music, art, or a scene of natural beauty has temporarily experienced a degree of ego loss (or the awareness of themselves as a separate individual).

Finally, I find findings in physics about the fundamental nature of reality to be consistent with the belief in an underlying unity and interconnectedness of everything beneath the apparent seperateness we observe. Ultimately, it's an illusion of perception.
 
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Taylor M

Well-Known Member
#5
Hi @Dyreal95
You make some interesting points. I think us as human beings have become victims of our own evolution, we have developed and adapted over millions of years to become the most intelligent and advanced species on the planet. And a sign of intelligence is a species ability to anticipate and predict the most likely scenarios in the future.
This has a downside in that all we do now worry about the future and attempt to second guess it, rather than taking time to savour and enrich the present.
As for spiritualty, I don't believe in an all loving, all powerful god either. There's far too much evil shit going on unchecked in the world to make me believe otherwise. But no matter how small our world is compared to the rest of the universe, we are still a part of it. A tiny, tiny, tiny chapter in a 13 billion year long story, but a chapter none the less.
 
#7
Hi Dyreal
(((((((((HUGS)))))))
A big emphatic YES, however it is only true for you, not "we" a spiritual awakening is a personal experience, just as life itself is. Stay tuned into that feeling of oneness and revisit it often.
It's your ego that is suicidal, show it there's more to life than death, shine light at your ego.
I don't think you need a teacher, you are a teacher.
Trust
Love and Light
P
A poem or 2 for you
www.suicideforum.com/community/threads/seek.127669/
www.suicideforum.com/community/threads/one-at-a-time.133625/
Can i ask if you have tried this so called "spiritual awakening"? I would really love to talk to some people who have tried this. And i get what you are saying... It feels like i am fighting against my ego and thoughts, but i am happy that i know where i wanna go now... Love and compassion is the only true way :)
 
#8
There are so many accounts of this loss of the sense of being a separate self, that I think it has to be an authentic experience, regardless of how it is described in the various spiritual traditions accross the world. In fact, I think more ' primitive' cultures were more in touch with the idea of a deeper unity of and interconnectedness of everything that exists underneath the appearance of seperateness on the surface. The feeling of transcending the ego (or sense of being a separate self) is also a common feature of ingesting certain substances and indeed ancient cultures often had rituals surrounding this. It's not recommended though because the effects of drugs are uncontrollable and unpredictable, and the experience of ego loss induced this way can be terrifying and dangerous as often, or more than, it is 'enlightening'. There is a lot of scientific research about this, but meditation is recommended as a much safer way, although it takes effort and practice over quite a long time to become stabilised.

There are also accounts in the psychological literature about 'peak experiences' of this kind which occur spontaneously across all cultures, and which seem to be quite common regardless of religious background, or lack of any religious background. It seems to be built into the brain itself and occurs whenever the right conditions are present, and these can occur spontaneously, or through a method like meditation. I think they're more common than we realize - anyone who has ever found themselves briefly absorbed in a beautiful piece of music, art, or a scene of natural beauty has temporarily experienced a degree of ego loss (or the awareness of themselves as a separate individual).

Finally, I find findings in physics about the fundamental nature of reality to be consistent with the belief in an underlying unity and interconnectedness of everything beneath the apparent seperateness we observe. Ultimately, it's an illusion of perception.
I found this post very interesting, and i am trying to understand it as good as i can. I am not very good at English and you sound like you have a very big vocabulary, so i didn't understand everything :-D
But have you experienced this "spiritual awakening" or something like it? I would love to hear about it :)
 
#9
Hi @Dyreal95
You make some interesting points. I think us as human beings have become victims of our own evolution, we have developed and adapted over millions of years to become the most intelligent and advanced species on the planet. And a sign of intelligence is a species ability to anticipate and predict the most likely scenarios in the future.
This has a downside in that all we do now worry about the future and attempt to second guess it, rather than taking time to savour and enrich the present.
As for spiritualty, I don't believe in an all loving, all powerful god either. There's far too much evil shit going on unchecked in the world to make me believe otherwise. But no matter how small our world is compared to the rest of the universe, we are still a part of it. A tiny, tiny, tiny chapter in a 13 billion year long story, but a chapter none the less.
I see what you mean, but are we truly the most intelligent when it seems like a lot of us suffers from depression and other things, because of this evolution?
I dont think our world is small compared to the universe. I think your world is the universe, and my world is also the universe, because we are the same. We are the same consciousness, the only difference is our consciousness is coming out from different bodies. We are not a body watching the universe.... we are the universe watching a body :)
 

Taylor M

Well-Known Member
#10
I see what you mean, but are we truly the most intelligent when it seems like a lot of us suffers from depression and other things, because of this evolution?
I dont think our world is small compared to the universe. I think your world is the universe, and my world is also the universe, because we are the same. We are the same consciousness, the only difference is our consciousness is coming out from different bodies. We are not a body watching the universe.... we are the universe watching a body :)
What your saying is similar to a concept called Pantheism (it's not a religion, more of a philosophy that dates back to the 17th century). The basic idea is that the universe wasn't created by God, but the universe IS God. An omnipresent consciousness that we are all a part of, every atom, every star, every galaxy is a part of this entity that is the cosmos itself.
It's a fascinating idea.
 

Lara_C

Forum Pro
SF Supporter
#11
found this post very interesting, and i am trying to understand it as good as i can. I am not very good at English and you sound like you have a very big vocabulary, so i didn't understand everything :-D
But have you experienced this "spiritual awakening" or something like it? I would love to hear about it :)
First of all, I don't think it's your English that's causing the difficulty, but the subject matter itself, being so outside the range of our ordinary, routine experience. If by "spiritual awakening" you mean an altered state of awareness in which the sense of being a separate self, or ego, is temporarily lost, I would say I have experienced moments of this at various times, both spontaneously and through some form of meditation. I think many people have, although they may not have recognised it at the time, but lots of them also say these peak experiences have been the most meaningful ones in their lives. They differ in intensity, but the most powerful are when we lose ourselves completely in whatever it is we happen to be aware of e.g. a beautiful sunset, a piece of music etc. The boundary between self and not- self is dissolved and we become one with whatever we focus our attention on. This is the core of the experience, however it may be couched in religious language.

This is why, for example, contemplating the qualities of God can lead to a profoundly life-changing experience in which the boundary is dissolved and the sense of being a limited, individual, self is absorbed in the greater Self which was previously assumed to be a separate entity distinct from us. I think this is what you might be referring to when you said in your opening post "Our thoughts is an illusion in our mind. We are not our thoughts, we are not even our body. There is something deeper behind" .

I mentioned that the experience of ego loss in which we become aware of the underlying unity behind everything, can feel terrifying, as well as liberating/enlightening, usually due to taking psychoactive drugs, but I've experienced this fear in meditation.
The reason the the feeling of ego loss can become terrifying is that through long habit, we identify ourselves with it i.e. as inherently separate individual beings, and the sudden, unexpected loss of this strong sense of self can feel like being on the verge of total extinction of awareness/existence itself. In fact, ego transcendence is just the loss of awareness of being a separate individual, not the loss of awareness per se. From that perspective, the sense of being a separate individual is seen to be only a thought in the mind, not our real identity. That's why meditation exercises are designed to slow down and eventually stop the rush of thoughts which cover the pure awareness underlying them, which is there independent of and prior to any thought, including the belief of being a separate ego.

Since all the problems of living are connected to our egos, the more we can escape from identifying ourselves with it, the more peace and happiness we can have. I recommend you read the research into peak experiences as well as the research on psychedelic substances, as well as descriptions of the ego-free state of awareness in the world's spiritual traditions. The core experience is the same, and as I said before, corresponds to the view of the underlying nature of reality being discovered by physics.
 
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#12
What your saying is similar to a concept called Pantheism (it's not a religion, more of a philosophy that dates back to the 17th century). The basic idea is that the universe wasn't created by God, but the universe IS God. An omnipresent consciousness that we are all a part of, every atom, every star, every galaxy is a part of this entity that is the cosmos itself.
It's a fascinating idea.
Can i ask if you believe in concept?
 
#13
Simple and easy...I have been depressed for about 3 years we can say 4 now.And it was caused by HUMANS...creatures that i call useless,i do not call myself a human nor a animal i call myself Perfect,i call myself God of MY world...and when i see people cry from emotions it just makes me sick,i have developed my body and myself so much as now im used to pain and whenever somethings bad happens it doesnt effect me sience i have lost interest...If i am interested on something DO it and i have proved it to myself whether its by getting rid of interest on emotional phyiscal pain or whether it is about school,today i just said everything we have learnt from physic on my class because i felt like it and i need physic on my future...So just to let you know you and on the righ route:
There is no GOD
Humans evolved wrong
Humans are useless on MOST of the parts because i cannot deny the fact that they have created so many things but if they were different they may have already created a new planet themselves.
Humans feel unnecessary pain and make a big deal of it.
<mod edit - rude and offensive>
 
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#15
Simple and easy...I have been depressed for about 3 years we can say 4 now.And it was caused by HUMANS...creatures that i call useless,i do not call myself a human nor a animal i call myself Perfect,i call myself God of MY world...and when i see people cry from emotions it just makes me sick,i have developed my body and myself so much as now im used to pain and whenever somethings bad happens it doesnt effect me sience i have lost interest...If i am interested on something DO it and i have proved it to myself whether its by getting rid of interest on emotional phyiscal pain or whether it is about school,today i just said everything we have learnt from physic on my class because i felt like it and i need physic on my future...So just to let you know you and on the righ route:
There is no GOD
Humans evolved wrong
Humans are useless on MOST of the parts because i cannot deny the fact that they have created so many things but if they were different they may have already created a new planet themselves.
Humans feel unnecessary pain and make a big deal of it.
They do not understand life and they rely on someone who doesn't exist GOD,they were easily fooled by some bible shit created by some humans that were desperate at the time and just thought "Lets create an imaginary friend called GOD and make every people pray for him,we felt pain so lets make them feel pain by letting our LIVES our FUTURES to this idiotic imaginary friend.Well you are right on most or parts and i am happy u understood the part of life and of god well most of it
I am sorry, but i dont feel like we agree on a lot. Life is meaningsless, that we agree on. I have never believed in god or anything. But if you listen to all the religions with a different perspective, i think that God and everything has a different meaning. The bible (and all other religions) is simply a way to guide us to love and compassion. You should not take it literraly. All the stories is just examples on how to act with compassion and love. The worlds is and awful place right now, but i see more and more people wake op, and realize what really matters. Happiness comes from inside, not the outside. Peace and Love
 
#16
Or God is all there is?
you say god exist...you are trying to prove the world has edges...thats right the world is on form of sphere...there were no god before to create time and life because time itsself dident exist without the explosion.Unless you find me better proof then "Look we have seen a winged horse and a person flying into paradise" or just "God was just there" then i cannot speak with you cuz you will sound just like every typical beliver.Also please dont bring me things like "Then how did thie small hole explode,when did it create" well its pretty easy sometimes from nothing comes everything sometimes just like Albert Ainstein from being dumb he became the smartest person alive because he pushed hisself over the limit he said "I wanna be special" "I wanna prove them all that i am superior than them" thats why it isnt GOD who you should rely on but vengence.Hate as much as possible try to get as much hate on others and you will see yourself pushing yourself over the limits you will see yourself (speaking if GOD existes) breaking the rules of this imaginary "All Mighty".I have done it and there were no greater feeling than seeings these Wrong Evolved humans loose to these simple things...
 

Taylor M

Well-Known Member
#17
Can i ask if you believe in concept?
In my view it's a beautiful idea, but that's all it is, an idea. So no I don't personally believe in it. I don't think we can ever fully get our heads round the nature of reality.
Like in "Hitchhikers guide to the galaxy" when a supercomputer spends millions of years trying to calculate the answer to the question "the meaning of life, the universe and everything?", and the eventual answer it gives is "42". The characters in the book are furious and disappointed in such an answer. To which the supercomputer responds "Did you really ever understand the question?".
 
#18
I am sorry, but i dont feel like we agree on a lot. Life is meaningsless, that we agree on. I have never believed in god or anything. But if you listen to all the religions with a different perspective, i think that God and everything has a different meaning. The bible (and all other religions) is simply a way to guide us to love and compassion. You should not take it literraly. All the stories is just examples on how to act with compassion and love. The worlds is and awful place right now, but i see more and more people wake op, and realize what really matters. Happiness comes from inside, not the outside. Peace and Love
I said that we agree on SOME part i cannot say and i will NEVER say that we agree together otherwise you would be my rival i am trying to be special here because as u said LIFE is meaningless thats why i will push myself over the limits to show everyone of you that LIFE is not something given by GOD with a reason but its some "spiritual" that has been created just like every other element on this world.
 

Lara_C

Forum Pro
SF Supporter
#20
In my view it's a beautiful idea, but that's all it is, an idea. So no I don't personally believe in it. I don't think we can ever fully get our heads round the nature of reality.
There is reason to believe that reality is not fundamentally composed of particles separated in space-time, and even that sub- atomic particles are more in the nature of ideas rather than substance. Space-time itself, composed of a collection of separate entities, may just be the way we perceive reality rather than reality as it exists when no one is perceiving it. The idea of only one underlying, undifferentiated reality appearing as separate things and forms in space-time appeals to me more than view of classical physics in which intrinsically separate entities are fundamental.
 
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